Is this even legal?

[Rashae]

I see that they can "lock down" military and family members, well obviously the military members, but is it even legal that they can put a lock down on the civilians? I just wouldn't think it would be! For example the Dodds teachers and whatnot... is it legal for them to be included in this?

[slickmetal]

I see that they can "lock down" military and family members, well obviously the military members, but is it even legal that they can put a lock down on the civilians? I just wouldn't think it would be! For example the Dodds teachers and whatnot... is it legal for them to be included in this?

Well even though this is discussed in other posts, yes it is...to a certain extent...if you have SOFA status, Lt.Gen Zilmer has your hiney (to protect, is the clause he uses - and to protect us/japanese relations)

[Isaak Brodsky]

Agreed with Slickmetal. If you enjoy SOFA, you agree to abide by the laws of SOFA. The senior commanding officer here has the privilege of enacting policy, and those in his/her charge - are obliged to abide by those policies.

One policy that changed, for example, since the 1995 rape was the banning of alcohol sales after 2100 hours at shopettes. So far as I know, this policy is still in place.

[Doomrider]

It's legal america owns your ass here.

[DoctorP]

Just waiting here to see what the teacher's union busts out with.

[DougP]

Agreed with Slickmetal. If you enjoy SOFA, you agree to abide by the laws of SOFA. The senior commanding officer here has the privilege of enacting policy, and those in his/her charge - are obliged to abide by those policies.

One policy that changed, for example, since the 1995 rape was the banning of alcohol sales after 2100 hours at shopettes. So far as I know, this policy is still in place.

And this is what I've been bringing up all this time. I invite anyone out there to review the SOFA and point out where it says that the General can lock down civilians be it Japanese or US when they have not committed crimes. I'm not sure what these "laws of SOFA" people are referring to that I have agreed to. Does the senior in command have the authority or privilege to enact unconstitutional or illegal orders? Orders that actually violate the SOFA when it comes to restricting Japanese citizens?

[OCanadaOurHomeAndNativeLand]

It's happening all over the USA. The Patriot Act, and related bills have steadily eroded freedoms in America and her possessions the last several years.

[Isaak Brodsky]

And this is what I've been bringing up all this time. I invite anyone out there to review the SOFA and point out where it says that the General can lock down civilians be it Japanese or US when they have not committed crimes. I'm not sure what these "laws of SOFA" people are referring to that I have agreed to. Does the senior in command have the authority or privilege to enact unconstitutional or illegal orders? Orders that actually violate the SOFA when it comes to restricting Japanese citizens?

DougP, great questions. You're likely referring to the spouses of military members who are Japanese citizens but who are apparently restricted from the same things that military folks are - as well as all other SOFA card holders.

I'm sure that as this lock down wears on that you'll see DoD civilians trying to challenge the general's order. I think that the widespread perception is that the commanding general reserves the right to set policy - no matter unjust those policies may appear. I agree with you that the actual terms of the SOFA should be looked at more carefully so that sensible law-abiding people can resist this apparent economic warfare that the CINC is now waging.

[DoctorP]

DougP...DocP just got a get out of jail free card!

[DougP]

DougP, great questions. You're likely referring to the spouses of military members who are Japanese citizens but who are apparently restricted from the same things that military folks are - as well as all other SOFA card holders.

I'm sure that as this lock down wears on that you'll see DoD civilians trying to challenge the general's order. I think that the widespread perception is that the commanding general reserves the right to set policy - no matter unjust those policies may appear. I agree with you that the actual terms of the SOFA should be looked at more carefully so that sensible law-abiding people can resist this apparent economic warfare that the CINC is now waging.

Absolutely which is why I will not accept this as just or rest until I am reassured by a legal team, with law degrees and not by those who assume that something is the way it is just because, that the military is within their rights to infringe upon our rights and the rights of Japanese citizens.

[OCanadaOurHomeAndNativeLand]

I recommend Lionel Hutz!

[KumaNoPooh]

He is not within his legal rights. A similar thing happened to civilians in Korea and the order was recened after civilians started writting numerous letters to the SENATE ARMED SERVICES COMMITTEE. Well here is the article again. Take a look at very good reading. I think he can only ask civilians to only abide by the spirit or intent of the order, unless there is a elevated threat level.


Curfew Issue (Apr 2005 - ???)
http://kalaniosullivan.com/OsanAB/OsanSongtanHistorya3.html#Curfew

http://www.nffe.org/ht/display/ArticleDetails/i/899/pid/176

[mikersoft]

I recommend Lionel Hutz!

Unfortunately, he's dead :(

;)

[Tanimaga]

Similiar conditions that occured in Korea, BUT they had the added ammo of not being allowed to attend religious functions. The current order provides for exceptions if applied and approved for. This is the way around Korea's problems I believe..

[KumaNoPooh]

I plan on making signs and putting them all over okinawa how LtGen Richard C. Zilmer took our Civil Rights Need to smear his name and get it the media even more

[DougP]

all your rights are belong to us.:D

[KumaNoPooh]

thats why we have a sick-out and post signs about the Martial Law he is imposing on us civilians just to get his name in the media and make for sure he does not get his fourth star. This ad is paid for by the people to get his fourth star

[KumaNoPooh]

this clown wants to screw with our lives lets srcew with his. start spreading
rumors of him.

[ryukyuboi]

Were the civilian workers in Korea SOFA sponsored? I was told that they were not, and therefore their union was successful in lifting the curfew on them. However, the curfew remained in effect for DoD civilians under SOFA, including the DoD teachers. This information came from a friend on mine who worked in Korea at the time the curfew was challenged.

I doubt if the teacher's union on Okinawa will move forward on this issue, unless the restriction period lasts for quite awhile. The curfew in Korea lasted 5 months or so before the civilian contractors gained relief.

[KumaNoPooh]

do what the special forces do get in country and get with others to turn remove power the LtGen. Use media and slander to remove him from power stage sick-outs place signs over okinawa along with leaflets any thing to get his name in the paper or media negatively

[KumaNoPooh]

need to boycott AAFES MCCS 18th Services and all the others during this embargo even gas go buy it out in town

[KumaNoPooh]

i plan on later going to the bx or px and buy some sheets and write on them how Lt Gen Zilmer took away my civil rights and hang it from my apartment this outta be nice since i m on the 6th floor for everybody to see

[KumaNoPooh]

i might try and submit a request to buy gas of base because now i will not give AAFES my money "we save you money everday" how about "We price gouge everyday"

[Isaak Brodsky]

Zilmer is an un-touchable.
AAFES is also an un-touchable Fortune 500 company. A full Okinawan boycott of AAFES would do nothing to its worldwide grip on power.
Resistance to AAFES is futile. So says Big Brother.

[DougP]

Zilmer is an un-touchable.
AAFES is also an un-touchable Fortune 500 company. A full Okinawan boycott of AAFES would do nothing to its worldwide grip on power.
Resistance to AAFES is futile. So says Big Brother.

You could lose your SOFA if you boycott AAFES:D

[Muku]

Well they are generous to only charge $2.99 huh at least it less than $3.00:-|
and the gas is not even good quality .......

Sorry but it's time to ......http://www.irvinehousingblog.com/wp-content/uploads/2007/04/whambulance.jpg


Come off base and try paying 125 to 150 yen per liter ok? :D

Disclaimer here;
This official call for the Whambulance is only directed to those here that complain about the "high" price of gasoline on base

[DougP]

Sorry but it's time to ......http://www.irvinehousingblog.com/wp-content/uploads/2007/04/whambulance.jpg


Come off base and try paying 125 to 150 yen per liter ok? :D

Disclaimer here;
This official call for the Whambulance is only directed to those here that complain about the "high" price of gasoline on base

Can't we're not allowed to:D

[KumaNoPooh]

i know that gas on base blows. I perfer off-base gas and when I can thats what I use. Try putting on-base in a Harley and watch your teeth fall out.

[Muku]

Can't we're not allowed to:D
I know plenty of places that deliver.:thumbup:

[Aidra]

One policy that changed, for example, since the 1995 rape was the banning of alcohol sales after 2100 hours at shopettes. So far as I know, this policy is still in place.

They extended sales on booze to 2400 in the last few months.

[Isaak Brodsky]

They extended sales on booze to 2400 in the last few months.

Ohhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh, that is definitely news. I thought for sure that 2100 hours would be the limit for daily sales in perpetuity.

Wonder if they'll change it back to 2100 hours again or, say, 1900 hours.