last thing I expected

[P_chan]

I just had some japanese jehovah's witnesses come to my door! Damn I can't get away from there no matter where I am! Why do they insist on bothering everyone?

[TheNoNamedOne]

Why not invite them in and talk to them? Could be fun (not sarcastic).

[P_chan]

how could they stop by once they know I'm in the military or work for the government? jehovah's witnesses are against swearing loyalty to any nation, or even saluting the flag. They use to ban you from voting in elections, but now they just strongly prohibit it. They consider saluting a flag or being loyal to your nation the worship of a false 'god'

[Tempestuous]

Guess they figure you made your decision out of "ignorance" of the subject. That they can convert you & get you outta the service???
Who knows.
Next time you can open the door with a flag shirt on, a cross necklace openly hanging around your neck, Tell them you believe in the trinity and that you have received two blood transfusions and would like to welcome them back tomorrow to your daughter's birthday party. :D

[Boost]

Next time you can open the door with a flag shirt on, a cross necklace openly hanging around your neck, Tell them you believe in the trinity and that you have received two blood transfusions and would like to welcome them tomorrow to your daughter's birthday party. :D

Don't encourage him to do that, they might execute him as being the anti-Christ!!!

[Tempestuous]

Oh, I thought of a couple more blatantly disrespectful things you could do,:D
light up a cigarette in front of them too, while holding the nastiest porn mag you can find under your arm & mentioning you and your live-in girlfriend were just getting ready to practice fornication as recommended in your magazine article.
(they don't approve of facial hair, earings or long hair on men either- but that is a little hard for a military guy to come up with just to bug someone. :) )


Perhaps you can disturb them enough to get them to quit visiting you in their door to door pleas....or they may decide to try harder.
*laugh*

[Tempestuous]

Don't encourage him to do that, they might execute him as being the anti-Christ!!!

According to them we are all guilty anyways, so what difference does it make?? They consider all clergy or equivalent to be Antichrist's - so he will just be adding to the fear of this immoral world. Now even "regular people" are antichrist's.....we have to work harder!!

[P_chan]

Actually I was half naked once I answered the door. It was too hot, I wear clothes for no one. I remember back home I used to piss them off royally once I was a kid. I would bother them while they were trying to convert children and tell them I worshiped the devil and other stupid stuff like that. I saw them coming one day and got ready for them. I answered the door in my underwear, a really small cowboy hat, a really small cowboy vest, a sock on my junk, and cool whip on my face. I told them I didn't have time my boyfriend was over and I closed the door. They sat on my front door stop praying for about an hour. Man I used to love messing with them!

[TheNoNamedOne]

Why not just listen to what they have to say and as an adult discuss your objections to their beliefs? I don't see any reason to purposely try and shock or enflame them.

If you didn't believe in helping Jerry's Kids and they solicited you for funds, would you act handicapped as you said no?

[dk]

Because some things just aren't worth listening to?

If JH's or any other religious group sent ANYONE to my door, I wouldn't give any of them the time of day. Why? Because I just don't have time. They're not worth it.

I would have time to answer the door in my boxers though.

[TheNoNamedOne]

Yes. If I didn't have time to talk as an adult with them, I sure wouldn't have time to act childish with them.

[P_chan]

but even if you try to act like an adult with them and have a conversation and debate your beliefs with them they will do the same thing every time. They will just tell you how your wrong and how right they are, no matter what you say. I still remember to this day what one of them said to me. I told them to leave the kids alone and stop bothering them and as they left they had the nerve to turn around and say "well you know sir we are saved.". Pompous assholes!

[Boost]

Yes. If I didn't have time to talk as an adult with them, I sure wouldn't have time to act childish with them.

Would you get over yourself already? It was a freaking joke, but if joking gets one deemed "childish", I guess we all better shape up here on these forums.

Welcome to the JU forums where only serious conversations and debate are allowed. Any joking must first be authorized by TP.

[Boost]

but even if you try to act like an adult with them and have a conversation and debate your beliefs with them they will do the same thing every time. They will just tell you how your wrong and how right they are, no matter what you say.

Ah crap, TP must be JW!

Oh wait, there goes that childish joking again and we'll have none of that around here!

[TheNoNamedOne]

Boost, look around the forum. You will see I have engaged in humor here and there. I do not need you to tell me which posts I can answer in either a humorous or serious manner, or even take as such. Though too much humor may be a bad thing, particularly sarcastic humor or humor misunderstood to be sarcastic.

But for your information, more and more of my posts will focus on more of the serious points brought up in the forums. You are welcomed to spend the majority of your time in the Jokes category if you wish.

But, to be honest, I like your posts. For the most part I find your posts well organized, thought out, intelligent, interesting, a high level of clarity, and a joy to reply to -- even though you may not have reciprocal thoughts to mine and like above seem a bit hostile to me. And not to mention, often in disagreement with me. That's ok.

I hope we get more members like you.

[Tempestuous]

Why not just listen to what they have to say and as an adult discuss your objections to their beliefs?


Because it is a waste of breathe & time! :D

Most door to door religious people are trained with specific answers to questions that commonly come up.
If you deviate from their training they will steer back to their trained answers and avoid answering your questions that are routed otherwise.

Also your "discussing" things with them only encourages them to come back...again, and again and again. Even if you don't agree, they feel there is potential in you to be converted.
So they set up continual return visits, they bring more literature, etc.

intentionally leading such people into the false hope of your conversion should make one feel bad. ;)

[Boost]

You are welcomed to spend the majority of your time in the Jokes category if you wish.


I think I will try and keep a balance of the two. I really don't mind serious discussions as well, but try not to stay on a consistent serious note. And some of the more serious topics recently have really been beatin up in the past so it is somewhat of a constant replay it seems. But what can you do when that is and has been a main topic in the news for so long.

I will try and refrain from telling you what to do from now on though seeing as I have so much power here ;)

[TheNoNamedOne]

intentionally leading such people into the false hope of your conversion should make one feel bad. ;)

One can easily remark, "I have no intention of converting, but I do enjoy, or would enjoy discussing the Bible and your beliefs -- if you would also be willing to answer my questions and objections towards yours. You know, so that I get a better understanding."

BAM! Honesty out in the open and done with. Quite mature and civil.

You never know, though. Even Jahova Witnesses leave their religion when they lose faith -- which could come from a question and answer period from a skeptic. Sure, they won't change in an instant, but sometimes when the seed of doubt has been properly planted, it can't help but grow into a strong root.

[Tempestuous]

One can easily remark, "I have no intention of converting, but I do enjoy, or would enjoy discussing the Bible and your beliefs -- if you would also be willing to answer my questions and objections towards yours. You know, so that I get a better understanding."

BAM! Honesty out in the open and done with. Quite mature and civil.

Have you actually done this with success?

You never know, though. Even Jahova Witnesses leave their religion when they lose faith -- which could come from a question and answer period from a skeptic. Sure, they won't change in an instant, but sometimes when the seed of doubt has been properly planted, it can't help but grow into a strong root.

This is why they travel in pairs or small groups, so a "leader" can pull them away should a person be spewing forth non-biblical (according to their translation) seeds.

They STRONGLY believe "bad association spoils useful habits" and are not to associate with non-believers.
You can go door to door, you can plant your own seeds, but by no means are you allowed to befriend or otherwise associate with non-believers as they WILL ruin you.

[TheNoNamedOne]

Have you actually done this with success?

Not in those exact words, but I have had JW come into my house and they knowing I was a skeptic and engaged me in discussion. And no, they didn't keep coming back and bothering me insessantly. In fact, they walk around this neighborhood almost every week knocking on doors. Once in a while will they come back, but they are not banging on my door making themselves a nusance -- and that is coming from a guy who has a low image of the Bible or other superstitions.

This is why they travel in pairs or small groups, so a "leader" can pull them away should a person be spewing forth non-biblical (according to their translation) seeds.

Perhaps, but sometimes they don't pull away fast enough. Well crafted metaphores really can change the world -- or at least a life.

They STRONGLY believe "bad association spoils useful habits" and are not to associate with non-believers.
You can go door to door, you can plant your own seeds, but by no means are you allowed to befriend or otherwise associate with non-believers as they WILL ruin you.

Really? Then the JW person I speak with on a friendly and regular basis without another minder nearby must just be pretendng to be a JW. With your information to me put forth as absolute fact then I am left wondering so. <not sarcastic>

Funny thing is, she never mentions JW unless I bring it up. She's never even invited me to her church, and she knows I am quite inquisitive about it at times even though I have never let on to her that I am a strong skeptic.

I think that other Christians are secretly Jealous of JW because they actually do what the Bible commands them to do, "to go out and preach the Good News" and they devote a lot of energy and recourses to that. They talk the talk and walk the walk, where as the other denominations find it easier to just deride them.

Many Christians of different kinds just can't seem to see themselves as brothers and sisters long enough to stop criticising one another and show the world an example of good will to one another which does not include back biting when the other is not around.

Hypocracy is rampant amongst them.

[Tempestuous]

they are not supposed to associate outside of general day to day interaction with non-believers. Keep a civilized interaction with neighbors/co-workers. But not be "friends" with or partake in functions in a friend/relationship type manner.

They will be unevenly yoked with another & the bad association will ruin their useful habits.

But who knows- maybe this is no longer pushed as heavily as it once was?

As far as "other Christian's" & JW's......they have different "rule books" :)

There are many religious groups that follow strongly their convictions; Muslims who follow through with the strict prayer life, Mormons who go on missions to convert as many as possible & practice baptizing the dead so they can save more souls, fundamental Mormons who still practice polygamy, Westboro Baptist Church who pickets & rallies anti-America propaganda at military funerals, etc, strongly follow after their beliefs and put into practice the rules that govern their church.
(that's just a start, there are many more broad religious groups who put into practice the writings of their beliefs & many individuals who do as well)

.

[DoctorP]

One can easily remark, "I have no intention of converting, but I do enjoy, or would enjoy discussing the Bible and your beliefs -- if you would also be willing to answer my questions and objections towards yours. You know, so that I get a better understanding."

BAM! Honesty out in the open and done with. Quite mature and civil.



I've done this...I've even told them to feel free and stay around and help me with my yardwork (weeding, cutting grass), which they did, and when we were done I gave them a drink and sent them on their way. They haven't been back since

[TheNoNamedOne]

Case in point, DrP, and they haven't been back to bother you like others just assume they will. JWs sound quite Christian like in the true sense when it comes to helping when being asked. I am not sure how many other Christian door to door evangelicals (and they are not ALL JWs) would stop their schedule for that day and help a stranger with their gardening.

But perhaps your whole post was sarcasm, Dr.P. Hard to tell. If it gets by me, someone may accuse me of not understanding humor.

[DoctorP]

No it was not sarcasm! This happened about 3 months ago. They worked for 2 hours. I never expected them to last that long, because I was working them like dogs. I suspect they haven't stopped again because they know that I will only talk to them if they help work. Basically that is what I told them. I don't have time for idle chit chat, but if you are willing to help out, we can talk and work.

[TheNoNamedOne]

Well, now perhaps some others who were harshly stereotypical of JWs would consider retracting some of their statements, or at least qualify them.

[P_chan]

But it's true. They aren't allowed to associate with someone outside of their religion unless it's to try and convert them. If someone leaves the JW faith then they are shunned by their friends and family. If the person stays with their family for some reason, they aren't treated very well by the other members of their house hold. The entire congregation shuns them because they are now an outside influence. Temp's post is pretty much right.

[Boost]

Well, now perhaps some others who were harshly stereotypical of JWs would consider retracting some of their statements, or at least qualify them.

Perhaps it would be in your best interest to realize that some of those others you speak of are former JW's.

I think I will give more credit to what they tell me then someone who cannot come across as anything less then a pompous a**.

[TheNoNamedOne]

Perhaps it would be in your best interest to realize that some of those others you speak of are former JW's.

Who?

I think I will give more credit to what they tell me then someone who cannot come across as anything less then a pompous a**.

Who and what part in particular?

[TheNoNamedOne]

But it's true. They aren't allowed to associate with someone outside of their religion unless it's to try and convert them. If someone leaves the JW faith then they are shunned by their friends and family. If the person stays with their family for some reason, they aren't treated very well by the other members of their house hold. The entire congregation shuns them because they are now an outside influence. Temp's post is pretty much right.

I don't think that is the part I or Dr.P was referring to. What we are saying is that just because you invite them in for conversation, it is not a given that they will be coming back and knocking on your door all the time. But that is the reason why many seem to go out of their way to either mock them, be rude to them, or act in some other way that is meant to repel them.

[Tempestuous]

No it was not sarcasm! This happened about 3 months ago. They worked for 2 hours. I never expected them to last that long, because I was working them like dogs. I suspect they haven't stopped again because they know that I will only talk to them if they help work. Basically that is what I told them. I don't have time for idle chit chat, but if you are willing to help out, we can talk and work.

Where these JW's? Or Mormon missionaries?
I have personally (as well as others I know) experienced the assistance of the LDS missionaries.
They put in the entire lawn of a friend, when they came buy and saw the lawn stuff & the hubby was sent TDY.

Pretty cool experience you had, even if it isn't the typical/norm experienced in the US by such titled individuals. Typically here it is a " I see you are busy, is there a better time I can come back by to talk with you?"

As for them not coming by relentlessly......maybe the national/social practices makes a difference?
The training is there- if you plant the seed, you mark it on the paperwork, the next group to get that territory have the opportunity to keep watering & nurturing it, in hopes to cultivate & harvest another member.

[Tempestuous]

Actually I was half naked once I answered the door. It was too hot, I wear clothes for no one. I remember back home I used to piss them off royally once I was a kid. I would bother them while they were trying to convert children and tell them I worshiped the devil and other stupid stuff like that. I saw them coming one day and got ready for them. I answered the door in my underwear, a really small cowboy hat, a really small cowboy vest, a sock on my junk, and cool whip on my face. I told them I didn't have time my boyfriend was over and I closed the door. They sat on my front door stop praying for about an hour. Man I used to love messing with them!

I have actually always been cordial & polite to all door to door salesmen, missionaries, witnesses, etc that come to the door. I just let them know I am not interested, have my own beliefs or what not and say good-bye.

Have had a few here or there that would put their feet in the door or grabbed the door or otherwise not accept the rejection, but not in quite some time.....the dog helps to keep the screen shut between both parties. :)

[P_chan]

yeah I am usually nice to them once they come to my door. But back home they came at least twice a week and it was annoying. So I had to divert to drastic measures.

[Tempestuous]

yeah I am usually nice to them once they come to my door. But back home they came at least twice a week and it was annoying. So I had to divert to drastic measures.

Completely understand