Tatoo discrimination in Japan

[TheNoNamedOne]

To me tatoos are a form of artistic expression and free speech. I don't think either of those should be discriminated against so long as they do not promote or incite others to commit violence. In Japan, though, traditionally, places such as bath houses and pools have discriminated against those with tatoos, denying those persons with them from entering or enjoying those services.

They often say that since tatoos have been traditionally associated with the yakuza (Japanese Mafia) that it would make other visitors uncomfortable or fearful. 30 years ago it is true, that for the most part then those with tatoos were related to organized crime, but it is clear that many people of today in Japan not associated with crime syndicates opt to have tatoos for the aesthetic pleasure of expressing themselves with bodies as their canvas.

Do you think that discrimination over tatoos, which is a freedom of speech and expression issue, should be permitted in places that hold themselves out to the public?

I don't think it should.

[dk]

I don't think so either. I think it's pretty rediculous that I have to put a bandage over my "anti-war" tattoo anytime I want to use a public pool. What? Am I going to pacify someone to death?

But then again, I hate the fact that a lot of public pools require guys to wear speedo's--which you will NOT catch me dead wearing.

[TheNoNamedOne]

I don't think so either. I think it's pretty rediculous that I have to put a bandage over my "anti-war" tattoo anytime I want to use a public pool. What? Am I going to pacify someone to death?

lol.

But then again, I hate the fact that a lot of public pools require guys to wear speedo's--which you will NOT catch me dead wearing.

I know what you mean! But that is where I met my wife -- at a health club where she worked and I was a member. And yes, they gave me THE RULES about tatoos and the must wear speedos. Thankfully, my then future wife didn't mind me in speedos.

[socalheart]

:D okay, still laughing at dk's post.

ahem, anyhow, it's the right of a private business to place restrictions on its customers. see the no shirt, no shoes rule thing stateside. it isn't right, but some people are just closed minded. like me about men who aren't olympic swimmers wearing speedos. speedos are wrong! maybe you can wear speedos under swimming trunks. :cool:

[dk]

I agree.

Speedos are Wrong!

[thistle]

I don't think tatoo's are something which are just discriminated in Japan, for me they are something I have only become used to seeing in the past maybe
8 years while living in central Okinawa. But where I grew up tatoo's were only something that tough, possibly gang related men had done, in Glasgow.
They were not something that the average person on the street would get done, because they wanted a piece of artwork on their body, like ear-piercing.
That image still stayed with me, and the image of a tatoo is something of a
fearful one.
That has all changed now and even in my small, rural town, now getting a tatoo is quite commonplace, but am pretty sure they are still discrimated against in certain public places.

[DoctorP]

I've been to bath houses, resorts, and beaches all over mainland Japan and Okinawa. I have never had a problem with my tatoos and I have never covered them. All I did was kindly inquire to the staff of the facilities about the rule and they always told me not to worry that the signs were intended strictly to keep out a certain group of people.

Now with that said...there were the occasional stares from the older generations, and once or twice an old man would leave the bath once I entered and I always felt that it was either due to my tatoo, or the fact that they felt inadequate around foreigners. Either way, I didn't take offense as it was his bath he ruined, not mine!

[TheNoNamedOne]

Either way, I didn't take offense as it was his bath he ruined, not mine!

lol.

You need some cultural sensitivity training, Dr.P, and a willingness to be courteous by forgoing the enjoyment you'd get from that bath so that others would not feel offended and leave before they had really wanted to.

[DoctorP]

While I was at the new Koza Music building yesterday, I couldn't help but notice that almost every young woman there had a tatoo or multiple tatoos. These were pretty young Okinawan/Japanese women around 20-25 years old. And we are not talking out of the way tatoos, I'm talking 4-6 inch long arm tatoos or across the back of the neck.

This makes me wonder what will happen in the next 10 years or so in Japan as when this generation hits their 30's and 40's and their use of the onsens, etc.... increases? Now when I am in mainland Japan (about 5-6 times a year) I rarely see a tatto on a woman at all when they frequent a bath house, resort, or beach, but obviously this will change, and I wonder how the businesses will take it?

[dk]

It's pretty obvious how they'll take it.

They'll take it the exact same way the conservative crowd in America took it. Initially, they'll be very much against it but as their leaders change and as they try to keep up with the times, eventually they'll get over their past and it won't even be an issue anymore.

[Fairlady]

I personally think that people should be able to express themelves in the way that they wish as long as it is not offensive to others. I know that sometimes that is a fine line, however I can see if they wanted to have someone cover up a tattoo that was very offensive to other people but, unless it is spoken upon and there have been complaints I think that it should be left be.

[ness4k]

I never plan on gettnig a tatoo myself but I dont think you should be denied services just becaues you have them...I would tell these businesses...You don't want my MONEY...fine I'll take my business elsewhere.

[P_chan]

I never plan on gettnig a tatoo myself but I dont think you should be denied services just becaues you have them...I would tell these businesses...You don't want my MONEY...fine I'll take my business elsewhere.

I explained this to fonze in another thread, and hell it might even be in this thread. The whole "no tattoos in spas" is a culture thing here in japan. Japanese people see tattoos on people and they think they're in the yakuza, since yakuza have full body tattoos, and they cover them in public. So an onsen (not sure if my japanese is correct there:D) does not want people there with tattoos. Otherwise the regular customers will think that yakuza goes there and stop going there, hurting business. So they usually have a policy that says you have to cover up your tattoo.

[Fonze]

I don't think so either. I think it's pretty rediculous that I have to put a bandage over my "anti-war" tattoo anytime I want to use a public pool. What? Am I going to pacify someone to death?

.

What are you going to do when there is world peace?:)

[Mad Hatter]

Swim Butt Naked!!!! And Pick a Fight!!!!

[dk]

Swim Butt Naked!!!! And Pick a Fight!!!!
Play a mean @$$ air guitar!!

[DougP]

dk can cover his tattoo with a band aid? :D *snicker*

[Mad Hatter]

But when you can play a mean @$$ air guitar... all the rest doesn't really matter!

[dk]

dk can cover his tattoo with a band aid? :D *snicker*
I couldn't afford anything bigger at the time. :(

[Go-Shay]

I think the no Tattoos policies were a simple and effective way to ban the Yaks without ruining your life or business. I have several of them as well as multiple piercings and have never had any problems.

Go-Shay