View Full Version : Off topic discussion on motive to discussing Jewish State right to exist
Perhaps Islamic/Palestinian militants will not be what destroys the Jewish ruled state of Israel. Instead, perhaps it will be simple demographics. After all, while Jews weild the power in their democratically elected government, they do so based on their majority of the population.
Demographics, however, could threaten this status soon, and the Jewish/Israeli government, as well as the Palestinians know this. While only a few years ago there was a loud demand for a separate Palestinian state and Jewish Israelis resisting that then, now Palestinians look at the changing demographics and say, "Why accept a Palestinian state with a Jewish state as a neighbor when we can just hunker down and use our future majority to vote in Muslims within the democratic system?"
And now Israelis are beginning to realize, their best chance to a continued Jewish state rested in the past when they should have accepted a Palestinian state then. If they try to pervert a democracy so that the minority rules over the majority within its borders proper, then they will be the new South Africa of old.
Should their right to exist as a Jewish state be affirmed and guaranteed over a majority Palestinian population?
Just a question here, well maybe two.....
Did you suddenly come upon this subject off the top of your head or is it meant to try to either draw in or tick off our new member here posting from Hafia? Which is it?
Is it your intent to piss off everyone?
Edited to add.....
Your timing is exquisite....:dead: as usual!
TheNoNamedOne
12-07-2007, 10:09 PM
Just a question here, well maybe two.....
Did you suddenly come upon this subject off the top of your head or is it meant to try to either draw in ortick off our new member here posting from Hafia?
Is it your intent to piss off everyone?
Irrelevant. The topic is a fair one. If you want to continue discussing motives, then create a thread topic on that. This is a thread topic on that.
Besides, no matter which answer you will get you will resist. Take it elsewhere.
Irrelevant. The topic is a fair one. If you want to continue discussing motives, then create a thread topic on that. This is a create a thread topic on that. This is a topic on thread topic on that. This is a topic on the OP.
Besides, no matter which answer you will get you will resist. Take it elsewhere.
What the heck are you trying to say here?:confused:
TheLastDon
12-07-2007, 10:16 PM
Muku I was wondering the same thing. I had posted this a week before that thread started about Miyako. I though it was my fault for awhile.
Yeah they're all descended from criminals. Miyako used to be the place they sent the undesirables. No offense to anyone I have a lot of friends from Miyako.
P_chan
12-07-2007, 10:18 PM
Bam, split already.
Before long, there will be a bastard thread child to every thread on this forum.
Two separate issues, Muku. Maybe the new member in Haifa got TP thinking in that direction, but his question in itself is a realistic one that is actively debated.
Steve I dont doubt that, and realize that this topic is one that is one a lot of peoples minds as well. The timing of the post however, and the way the OP was written, well it.............
Our new member from there has also made it clear that his English skills are not that great, and if I was from there and saw a thread like this pop up within a few days of joining a new forum, I would think that
"Hey am I welcome there?"
Two separate issues, Muku. Maybe the new member in Haifa got TP thinking in that direction, but his question in itself is a realistic one that is actively debated.
Unfortunately it's confused by TPs post as well:
Who exactly is going to do the affirming? The UN? There have been loads of resolutions to date, many ignored by both sides.
Also, are you thinking that there will be an Arab majority within the present borders ("Green Line") of Israel? The current Arab population is something like 10 percent. But if you mean including the occupied West Bank, yes, the Jews will be a minority soon. Then the easy solution is to give the West Bank back to the owners and let them have their state. I don't believe that Palestinian strategists are deliberately rejecting negotiations so they will remain part of Israel. On the other hand, there are two intractable problems (Jerusalem and the right of return) that would have to be solved before there will be a final separation.
This was in response to this right?
Just a question here, well maybe two.....
Did you suddenly come upon this subject off the top of your head or is it meant to try to either draw in or tick off our new member here posting from Hafia? Which is it?
Is it your intent to piss off everyone?
Edited to add.....
Your timing is exquisite.... :dead:as usual!
TheNoNamedOne
12-07-2007, 10:25 PM
Muku, keep your posts about motive in here and address OP in the other thread. Thank you. -- OP in the other thread. Thank you. -- TP, moderator
Bam, split already.
Before long, there will be a bastard thread child to every thread on this forum.
Well at least only on "his" threads:rolleyes:
This kind of crap is getting out of hand here!
okisteve
12-07-2007, 10:27 PM
Right
That's what it was in response to
okisteve
12-07-2007, 10:29 PM
Too messy. I'm outta here. I thought it was going to be a discussion.
TheLastDon
12-07-2007, 10:31 PM
I think TP is drunk!?!
Off topic posts on the motive of the thread have been moved here: http://www.japanupdate.com/forum/showthread.php?t=2608.
Now I am going to push it here........
What are you going to do next? My reply was valid you chose to split the thread because you didnt like the content of the replies that were coming and you chose to give me a warning for it.....well here we go again.....
Just a question here, well maybe two.....
Did you suddenly come upon this subject off the top of your head or is it meant to try to either draw in or tick off our new member here posting from Hafia? Which is it?
Is it your intent to piss off everyone?
Edited to add.....
Your timing is exquisite.... as usual!
I think TP is drunk!?!
And I am getting the infractions for it!
This is bs....
TheNoNamedOne
12-07-2007, 10:35 PM
Now I am going to push it here........
What are you going to do next? My reply was valid you chose to split the thread because you didnt like the content of the replies that were coming and you chose to give me a warning for it.....well here we go again.....
Like I have told you, keep the discussion to the motive in the thread created for it. Thank you. -- TP, moderator
ja_Patriot
12-07-2007, 10:36 PM
TP,
Did you notice that the enjoyment of many members here was interrupted the moment you logged in? Be honest with yourself, and ask yourself what you can do about it, will you?
Speaking for myself, the last thing I really need in this short life is useless aggravation.
TP,
Did you notice that the enjoyment of many members here was interrupted the moment you logged in? Be honest with yourself, and ask yourself what you can do about it, will you?
Speaking for myself, the last thing I really need in this short life is useless aggravation.
JA watch out my friend, this is going to get moved to the "other" thread as well.
Damn and it was such a fun night up until now....
Gnight!
Now I cant tell if this was posted in the original thread or the damn split one.
Shit it was moved....lightening speed! I am not dreaming here! Shit that had to be record speed!:thumbdown:
Screw it.
JA, PChan TLD had fun tonight thanks guys.:thumbup:
TheNoNamedOne
12-07-2007, 10:39 PM
TP,
Did you notice that the enjoyment of many members here was interrupted the moment you logged in? Be honest with yourself, and ask yourself what you can do about it, will you?
Speaking for myself, the last thing I really need in this short life is useless aggravation.
Ja, please keep the off topic remarks in this thread and not where they were moved from, Thank you. -- TP, moderator
P_chan
12-07-2007, 10:40 PM
Well at least only on "his" threads:rolleyes:
This kind of crap is getting out of hand here!His timing does seem to be a little too convenient. I think a lot of TPs threads are meant to get people riled up, I've been saying that since I've been a member here. The only reason he gets away with it, is because he's a moderator.
Nothing wrong with addressing controversial issues in threads. But once you make threads like this (http://www.japanupdate.com/forum/showthread.php?t=2422&highlight=miyako) I really start to wonder what a person's real motives are.
Anyways, I'm going to take a break from all this TP BS. I'm going to take a shower then I'll pop back in to see what's new.
Ever wonder how much less drama we would have in the world if people would just answer the ******* question? Muku brings up a real concern. There is nothing WRONG with your OP. There is no reason to remove your thread, and I hope it does get debated. But did you post this thread as a welcome mat of sorts to our new Israeli member? Did you just not know that we picked up a new Israeli member today? I have no quarel with you, and I am not going to shut down your other thread or complain at you for splitting your thread, but the question of your intentions was also on my mind the minute I noticed this new thread, and I'm sure it's on the minds of our other readers as well.
There is nothing wrong with your thread. I agree with Muku though when he said your timing is impeccable. I will not be removing TP's thread as there is nothing about it that violates any of our rules, so do not ask me to remove it. And I will not question TP's judgement on splitting the thread so quickly. It's his thread, he can keep it as clean as he wants, and if any of you disagree and feel the need to spam up his thread with off topic comments, don't come running to me if you get moderated.
His timing does seem to be a little too convenient. I think a lot of TPs threads are meant to get people riled up, I've been saying that since I've been a member here. The only reason he gets away with it, is becuase he's a moderator.
Nothing wrong with addressing controversial issues in threads. But once you make threads like this (http://www.japanupdate.com/forum/showthread.php?t=2422&highlight=miyako) I really start to wonder what a persons real motives are.
P what is it 2 days, maybe 1 day? We get a new member here posting from Hafia Israel, who admits to not having the greatest English skills, and then TP comes up with "this" topic?
Valid topic....3 or 4 days ago maybe, now....yeah right! Great way to make a new member here feel friggin welcome to the forums....Yo dude does your country have a right to friggin exist?
Roll out the welcome mat....get ****** it how it sounds to me!
kombu_kid
12-07-2007, 10:44 PM
Sometimes when people assume that someone started a thread will ill-intentions in mind, their imaginations can "take the ball and run with it" to wherever they want. Why is it that some people assume there was an intention to make someone uncomfortable, as opposed to, just discussing a subject that's close to home to that person?
His timing does seem to be a little too convenient. I think a lot of TPs threads are meant to get people riled up, I've been saying that since I've been a member here. The only reason he gets away with it, is because he's a moderator.
Not this again...
Listen, it is perfectly acceptable to post controversial threads. It is perfectly ok to post threads that you know for a fact will get people riled up. You can do it. I can do it. TP can do it.
Ever wonder how much less drama we would have in the world if people would just answer the ******* question? Muku brings up a real concern. There is nothing WRONG with your OP. There is no reason to remove your thread, and I hope it does get debated. But did you post this thread as a welcome mat of sorts to our new Israeli member? Did you just not know that we picked up a new Israeli member today? I have no quarel with you, and I am not going to shut down your other thread or complain at you for splitting your thread, but the question of your intentions was also on my mind the minute I noticed this new thread, and I'm sure it's on the minds of our other readers as well.
There is nothing wrong with your thread. I agree with Muku though when he said your timing is impeccable. I will not be removing TP's thread as there is nothing about it that violates any of our rules, so do not ask me to remove it. And I will not question TP's judgement on splitting the thread so quickly. It's his thread, he can keep it as clean as he wants, and if any of you disagree and feel the need to spam up his thread with off topic comments, don't come running to me if you get moderated.
My first reply was not spam, it was a valid question, his timing was exquisite and there is no reason for issuing a warning to me for it either. That was heavy handed.
Now then I agreed that the topic is probably valid, three or 4 days ago but now? Come one, is that how this forum wants to treat newcomers?
I hope not.
Why is it that some people assume there was an intention to make someone uncomfortable, as opposed to, just discussing a subject that's close to home to that person?
And I think this is a very valid point as well.
Come one, is that how this forum wants to treat newcomers?
TP can answer this question if he wants to.
TheLastDon
12-07-2007, 10:48 PM
Something is not stirring the cool-aide just right for me either.
Sometimes when people assume that someone started a thread will ill-intentions in mind, their imaginations can "take the ball and run with it" to wherever they want. Why is it that some people assume there was an intention to make someone uncomfortable, as opposed to, just discussing a subject that's close to home to that person?
Come on, I know what you are saying here, yet give me a break, up until now TP's threads have been about blasting either criminals from Miyako or Animal right's activites, to Marine Corp "traditions" etc etc etc...out of the clear blue Israel?
TheNoNamedOne
12-07-2007, 10:49 PM
I had every intention of answering Muku's questions but at the pace all the offtopic posts were coming and the time it was taking in moving them, I could not get to them.
My posting is extra slow now due to using a notebook computer rented in a hotel. Not used to the new keyboard and the commands, many which are in Japanese.
My post comes from a recent newpaper article just a few days that either appeared in The Washington Post or the New York Times, It focused on demographics and have not made this for our new member, IN fact, we have other members who are Jewish and the topic goes out for their opinion equally and I could care less who of them or any other enter into the discussion or choose to ignore it. They are free to do either.
TP can answer this question if he wants to.
Yet you are the "boss" here not him right?
Is that how you want to welcome new members?
P_chan
12-07-2007, 10:50 PM
I didn't say it wasn't ok to discuss a controversial subject. But IMO poking and prodding is as bad as flaming or trolling. It's like brining beer to an AA meeting.
To me that whole miyako thread is a slap in the face to a lot of members here. It would be like me coming in here and saying: "Hey even though I know a lot of you could have okinawan or miyakoan wives, children, relatives, or friends, I'm still going to call them all criminals because their ancestors are criminals."
Thank you TP. That's enough for me.
Thank you TP. That's enough for me.
Right while I get kicked in the ass for it?
TheNoNamedOne
12-07-2007, 10:54 PM
Come on, I know what you are saying here, yet give me a break, up until now TP's threads have been about blasting either criminals from Miyako or Animal right's activites, to Marine Corp "traditions" etc etc etc...out of the clear blue Israel?
not so, Muku, In the past I created a thread about Israel, too,
I Think it was titled: Do you care about Israel? Do a search or you can find it in my profile thread list.
Yet you are the "boss" here not him right?
Is that how you want to welcome new members?
I was waiting for his answer, which I received.
I, the boss of the forums, see nothing wrong with letting TP keep that thraed. I, the boss of the forums, know that people get offended over different reasons, and I, the forum boss, do not differentiate between possibly offending someone who is new here compared to possibly offending someone who has been here for three days, three months, or three years.
If someone is offended by something, there are other threads to read. I personally skip several of TP's threads, and I probably wouldn't have even bothered with this thread if all this madness hadn't happened.
I wouldn't recommend that the most timid Christians step foot in the religion category. Pretty much every thread in there would offend my relatives. Some threads in other categories offend me, but I do not force everything that offends me to be deleted, even if it is timely.
P_chan
12-07-2007, 10:56 PM
Damn, the day after muku joined I should have created a thread about how much cheese heads from Wisconsin suck.
not so, Muku, In the past I created a thread about Israel, too,
I Think it was titled: Do you care about Israel? Do a search or you can find it in my profile thread list.
Why not discuss it in that thread?
Right while I get kicked in the ass for it?
I didn't say, "Thank you TP. That's enough for Muku".
Enjoy the discussion. I have other things calling me right now.
ja_Patriot
12-07-2007, 10:58 PM
dk,
Look at the OP. "Does a Jewish Israel have an inherent right to exist". Not the state or country of Israel mind you. The "Jewish" definition is already slanted. As opposed to what? An "Arab Israel" or a "Palestinian Israel"?
Now if one of the mods can't see the slant, then there is bias.
You're centrist /left, DocP is a liberal /progressive as he stated and TP is fringe far left. Just a respectful question: Is it time to admit that there has to be a balance somewhere?
Just giving my 2 cents. But if you could look further into this, it would be appreciated.
Edited to add:
Shouldn't another mod with opposing views take the cudgels on restraining the far leftist back when he steps over the fringe instead of having to bother you?
TheNoNamedOne
12-07-2007, 10:58 PM
Ian, I think your post quote is relevant to the original thread, Why post it here when it would be very complimentary to the original discussion? It would also be great that if you do repost it over there, you could give some commentary on it. Iam interested in knowing what you think, not jsut knowing what you find and paste.
TheNoNamedOne
12-07-2007, 11:03 PM
Why not discuss it in that thread?
Because that topic OP was set up diffferent from this one.
There can be several discussions on George Bush can't there if they target different aspects. Just like there can be more than one discussion on food or beautiful women -- or photos of them. We already know that from looking at those.
I, the boss of the forums, see nothing wrong with letting TP keep that thraed. I, the boss of the forums, know that people get offended over different reasons, and I, the forum boss, do not differentiate between possibly offending someone who is new here compared to possibly offending someone who has been here for three days, three months, or three years.
If someone is offended by something, there are other threads to read. I personally skip several of TP's threads, and I probably wouldn't have even bothered with this thread if all this madness hadn't happened.
I wouldn't recommend that the most timid Christians step foot in the religion category. Pretty much every thread in there would offend my relatives. Some threads in other categories offend me, but I do not force everything that offends me to be deleted, even if it is timely.
Dk I am sorry but this answer is side stepping the question that I posed to you.
As I have already noted here it is the timing.....not the topic.
didn't say, "Thank you TP. That's enough for Muku".
Enjoy the discussion. I have other things calling me right now
So in effect are you saying that we/I have to eat shit .
P_chan
12-07-2007, 11:23 PM
Because that topic OP was set up diffferent from this one.
So why not revive the thread with a new question relating to isreal? I've seen you do it in other threads, why not that one?
So why not revive the thread with a new question relating to isreal? I've seen you do it in other threads, why not that one?
P chan....really now, not wanting to sound too sarcastic here and not meant to be taken as condescending, but.....I think you of all people know "the" why.
Edited to add......
Knowing damn well that this is going to add to the shit here......
Is it convenience or coincidence? TP and EEL BOTH having computer problems at the same damn time? I must be getting cynical and paranoid in my :old: :dead: age here. Just another one of those things that make a person go Hmmmm! I hope the two of them enjoyed their evening out together!<3
TheNoNamedOne
12-07-2007, 11:31 PM
So why not revive the thread with a new question relating to isreal? I've seen you do it in other threads, why not that one?
Because it is not the same. It would break that thread's flow.
Again, there are several threads where different aspects of beautiful women or even food is discussed. Likewise, different threads about the military
, music, jokes, etc...
If the topic is different on a specific wide theme, discussions can exist separate from one another on different threads. In fact, that is the best way to keep topics as clean and straight going forward as possible. Think how hard it would be to follow one loooooong thread just about Okinawa with all the different aspects of it crroweded in one thread. Yikes!
P_chan
12-07-2007, 11:36 PM
Because it is not the same. It would break that thread's flow.
But that thread was dead for the longest time. Why not revive it with a new question? You've done this before (so has other users) and it works. Then if the discussion starts to really get going, split the thread. You've done that before too.
Again, there are several threads where different aspects of beautiful women or even food is discussed. Likewise, different threads about the military
, music, jokes, etc...
There really is only one active (used to be active) thread about pretty ladies. That was my "who's your favorite model" thread. Also, not all jokes are the same, neither is music. While your new Israel thread has something very much in common with your old Israel thread. That would be Israel.
DoctorP
12-07-2007, 11:43 PM
dk,
Look at the OP. "Does a Jewish Israel have an inherent right to exist". Not the state or country of Israel mind you. The "Jewish" definition is already slanted. As opposed to what? An "Arab Israel" or a "Palestinian Israel"?
Now if one of the mods can't see the slant, then there is bias.
dk has already stated that the topic does not break the rules. You are free to create discussion topics about pretty much anything you like...you are also free to NOT read any thread that you like.
You're centrist /left, DocP is a liberal /progressive as he stated and TP is fringe far left. Just a respectful question: Is it time to admit that there has to be a balance somewhere?
This is not Fox News...and to be honest...I don't think that I can be pigeon holed into one group anyway.
Edited to add:
Shouldn't another mod with opposing views take the cudgels on restraining the far leftist back when he steps over the fringe instead of having to bother you?
There is no reason for anyone else to step in. TP is doing fine moderating the thread and keeping it on topic. The problem seems to be that too many people want to police TP! If you guys/gals would just lay off a bit, the forums would be a much nicer place...why does everyday have to turn into a witch hunt around here?
There is no reason for anyone else to step in. TP is doing fine moderating the thread and keeping it on topic. The problem seems to be that too many people want to police TP! If you guys/gals would just lay off a bit, the forums would be a much nicer place...why does everyday have to turn into a witch hunt around here?
What else would anyone expect a fellow moderator to say here? Lay off a bit? Geez how about telling that to him. Things works both ways you know, and you are not always right either you know.
you are also free to NOT read any thread that you like.
This is getting to be a broken record coming from you...seems like your most common reply when shit starts hitting the fan with regards to topics and subjects regarding TP.
I understand your need to cover his back, but if this forum was just the three of you it would be a rather lonely place too.
Give us the benefit of the doubt as well. Also dont treat us as if we were lab rats either.
TheNoNamedOne
12-07-2007, 11:50 PM
But that thread was dead for the longest time. Why not revive it with a new question? You've done this before (so has other users) and it works. Then if the discussion starts to really get going, split the thread. You've done that before too.
There really is only one active (used to be active) thread about pretty ladies. That was my "who's your favorite model" thread. Also, not all jokes are the same, neither is music. While your new Israel thread has something very much in common with your old Israel thread. That would be Israel.
If someone wants to revive a thread, it is their right to do so, but it seems that whenever I do, Pchan, and you already do not like the topic, you or Muku like to do your "necro" commenting on it.
@red: What they have in common is humor. Very wide commonality.
What my two threads have in common on Israel is simply Israel -- another wide commonality, for there are many aspects to Israel, and they can rightfully be broken down for discussion in separate topics.
kombu_kid
12-07-2007, 11:52 PM
True to that! It's almost like there's some of ya'll lying in wait to pounce on some people here like a pack o' wolves as soon as they post. And BTW, I think some people would still dog out TP if he were to continue the previous Israel thread, citing the same reasons they did for his new thread on it. It's starting to look like it's more fun for some posters here to rip people to shreds than talk about different subjects. C'mon, let's not turn on ourselves here.
What my two threads have in common on Israel is simply Israel -- another wide commonality, for there are many aspects to Israel, and they can rightfully be broken down for discussion in separate topics
You missed something from your own OP....you wrote JEWISH state.
BIG difference, your view as pointed out earlier here is already slanted.
I dont see you refering to an Islamic Iran or Christian US.
DoctorP
12-07-2007, 11:54 PM
What else would anyone expect a fellow moderator to say here? Lay off a bit? Geez how about telling that to him. Things works both ways you know, and you are not always right either you know.
Why did you need to posts anything in that thread if you weren't going to answer the post? Who is the one causing the problem here? Really....think about that for a second. If you didn't post anything at all, then maybe his OP would be sitting there all alone. Instead you had to poke at him, and started a whole seperate off topic thread...and even fueled his original thread a bit.
This is getting to be a borken record coming from you...seems like your most common reply when shit starts hitting than with regards to topics and subjects regarding TP.
I understand your need to cover his back, but if this forum was just the three of you it would be a rather lonely place too.
Give us the benefit of the doubt as well. Also dont treat us as if we were lab rats either.
Borken? Is that Vulcan talk?? :D You, as well as anyone should realize that I don't always agree with TP. I have made a choice just to not read his threads...I don't understand why you feel compelled to follow him around all over the forums. You hear this on all forums..not just this one. Sorry if it gets old for you...seems you hear it more than most.
P_chan
12-07-2007, 11:56 PM
If someone wants to revive a thread, it is their right to do so, but it seems that whenever I do, Pchan, and you already do not like the topic, you or Muku like to do your "necro" commenting on it.This is more of a running joke.
As for the rest of your post, look at my mood
True to that! It's almost like there's some of ya'll lying in wait to pounce on some people here like a pack o' wolves as soon as they post. And BTW, I think some people would still dog out TP if he were to continue the previous Israel thread, citing the same reasons they did for his new thread on it. It's starting to look like it's more fun for some posters here to rip people to shreds than talk about different subjects. C'mon, let's not turn on ourselves here.
Dont start bullshit threads....did you read this split thread though? Do you see where it was coming from?
If you did and still came to the same conclusion than I wonder how you would feel if you were a new member here and have that tossed in your face after 1 friggin day on the forum
Plus EVERYONE damn well knows that anything dealing with the Middle East and particularly Israel is sensitive. To say otherwise is purely assinine.
Why did you need to posts anything in that thread if you weren't going to answer the post? Who is the one causing the problem here? Really....think about that for a second. If you didn't post anything at all, then maybe his OP would be sitting there all alone. Instead you had to poke at him, and started a whole seperate off topic thread...and even fueled his original thread a bit.
Borken? Is that Vulcan talk?? :D You, as well as anyone should realize that I don't always agree with TP. I have made a choice just to not read his threads...I don't understand why you feel compelled to follow him around all over the forums. You hear this on all forums..not just this one. Sorry if it gets old for you...seems you hear it more than most.
Did you even read the thread? Or are you just popping in here nd commenting on the most recent posts?
I feel sorry for people here that get shit on by him, and I also take offense at the topics he raises because like it or not many of them are either racist or discriminatory.
OK they dont break the holy rules here....but they are divisive to say the least, and as long as they continue I am going to continue to bitch and do my damndest to put things straight.
Might as well get used to that.
ja_Patriot
12-08-2007, 12:04 AM
dk has already stated that the topic does not break the rules. You are free to create discussion topics about pretty much anything you like...you are also free to NOT read any thread that you like.
This is not Fox News...and to be honest...I don't think that I can be pigeon holed into one group anyway.
There is no reason for anyone else to step in. TP is doing fine moderating the thread and keeping it on topic. The problem seems to be that too many people want to police TP! If you guys/gals would just lay off a bit, the forums would be a much nicer place...why does everyday have to turn into a witch hunt around here?
Was it not obviously noticeable to you that everything was humming along peacefully and quietly, self-moderated by members, until TP and that other poster logged in later in the evening?
I know you aware of these sub-rules for moderators as I've posted them twice already.
On some boards, moderators are expected to stay out of all contentious debates, or at least to use alternate accounts to engage in them unbeknownst to common members. On most boards, however, moderators may participate just as any normal member, provided they remain civil and generally obey the site rules. Some boards require moderators not to moderate any discussion or topic they're involved in, and many moderators on other boards take this upon themselves to avoid conflict of interest and bias.
How about this? We can all self moderate, as we did for most of the day. Try it for a few days to see if it works.
DoctorP
12-08-2007, 12:05 AM
Did you even read the thread? Or are you just popping in here nd commenting on the most recent posts?
I read the thread after you reported it. I investigate all reported posts...which tends to take a lot of my time! Just because I don't agree with something, doesn't mean that it needs to be silenced.
TheLastDon
12-08-2007, 12:05 AM
I'm behind Muku, I think the timing was a little funny to say the least.
Then for him to get an infraction for it, that is a bunch of BS!
You all say people are allowed to post freely so If Muku questions a thread he is not free to do that?
I read the thread after you reported it. I investigate all reported posts...which tends to take a lot of my time! Just because I don't agree with something, doesn't mean that it needs to be silenced.
Ok fair enough...yet would you feel welcome as a newcomer and the only member here posting from Israel to be met with a thread like "that" after your first day on a new forum?
It wouldnt surprise me one little bit if he never shows up here again. And I get the impression that NOONE of you care one iota about it either.
DoctorP
12-08-2007, 12:08 AM
Was it not obviously noticeable to you that everything was humming along peacefully and quietly, self-moderated by members, until TP and that other poster logged in later in the evening?
How about this? We can all self moderate, as we did for most of the day. Try it for a few days to see if it works.
Who is the other poster you mention? TP hasn't done anything but moderate his own thread...where is the problem in that?
How about this...everyone self moderate...and also quit creating unnecessary drama! :thumbdown: I honestly think too many people hit the sauce late at night and then say...what can I do to create havoc in the forums tonight?
How about this...everyone self moderate...and also quit creating unnecessary drama! I honestly think too many people hit the sauce late at night and then say...what can I do to create havoc in the forums tonight?
You see it as "uneccessary", however there are "us" here that look at it differently......do you take that into consideration?
If you do it doesnt seem to come across that way.
P_chan
12-08-2007, 12:12 AM
I honestly think too many people hit the sauce
Where was I once this "sauce" was being handed out?
You all say people are allowed to post freely so If Muku questions a thread he is not free to do that?
He got a warning, not an infraction. And it wasn't for making a post. It was for moving something back into the original thread that TP moved out of it into the off-topic thread. It was basically Muku telling TP to eat shit.
DoctorP
12-08-2007, 12:14 AM
I'm behind Muku, I think the timing was a little funny to say the least.
Then for him to get an infraction for it, that is a bunch of BS!
You all say people are allowed to post freely so If Muku questions a thread he is not free to do that?
People are free to post...but it seems all too often that Muku is on a witch hunt...lurking in the darkness and hoping to bring TP down. Life is too short for that type of shit!
If you want to reply to a post...keeping the discussion flowing, that is fine, but why post questioning the OP's intent? Just like my momma used to say "Don't have something nice to say? Don't say nothin'"
Of course I don't expect everyone to stay silent...t'would be a boring forum...but why create the extra drama? I could care less if you start a seperate thread (which happened today) discussing the OP's intent and timing. Have at it....but keep the original thread clear of the BS!
I stay out of the more serious discussions...as I get enough of that during the day...I come here for other reasons. I understand TP and many others hope for more deep, stimulating discussion, and that is just not me. I try to stay out of those threads, and to keep from pulling them off topic.
DoctorP
12-08-2007, 12:14 AM
Where was I once this "sauce" was being handed out?
In the shower! :rolleyes:
He got a warning, not an infraction. And it wasn't for making a post. It was for moving something back into the original thread that TP moved out of it into the off-topic thread. It was basically Muku telling TP to eat shit.
That is where you are wrong.............
I asked a valid question and he didnt like the question and split the topic.
I used the question in reply......it was TP telling me to eat shit.
Oh one other thing take a look at the timing. You have the logs you know.
People are free to post...but it seems all too often that Muku is on a witch hunt...lurking in the darkness and hoping to bring TP down. Life is too short for that type of shit!
I gave you the reason why I post the way I do in regards to many of his threads.
I see you havent taken the time to actually see which ones I am replying to so I dont expect you to know.
If you want to reply to a post...keeping the discussion flowing, that is fine, but why post questioning the OP's intent? Just like my momma used to say "Don't have something nice to say? Don't say nothin'"
Like it or not this reply is gratuitous and condescending as well.
I stay out of the more serious discussions...as I get enough of that during the day...I come here for other reasons. I understand TP and many others hope for more deep, stimulating discussion, and that is just not me. I try to stay out of those threads, and to keep from pulling them off topic.
That is your choice, however you shouldnt be expecting "everyone" to follow in your footsteps either.
DoctorP
12-08-2007, 12:21 AM
That is your choice, however you shouldnt be expecting "everyone" to follow in your footsteps either.
I never asked you too! You read way too much into things.
DoctorP
12-08-2007, 12:21 AM
For being my "bitch" you sure are being difficult! :D
I never asked you too! You read way too much into things.
No I take your replies at face value. Your common theme is obvious...."Dont reply, it isnt necessary, I dont do it, so on so forth...."
I've heard this and similar comments from you before. Am I wrong? I dont think so.
For being my "bitch" you sure are being difficult! :D
Damn straight:D:thumbup:
Have you ever met one that wasnt?
TheLastDon
12-08-2007, 12:24 AM
Well I guess I read too much between the lines or not enough, maybe I have been hitting the "sauce" too much.
Question a thread by a moderator and have it moved somewhere else, makes sense to me.
That is where you are wrong.............
I asked a valid question and he didnt like the question and split the topic.
I used the question in reply......it was TP telling me to eat shit.
Oh one other thing take a look at the timing. You have the logs you know.
Did you not post the text back in the original thread? I am positive I remember you asking Okisteve or someone else if their response was due to what you posted in your original reply. I remember you posting the exact text in a post, and then that post dissappearing from the original thread (probably moved into here).
That is what I thought you received the warning for. Putting it back, not asking the question.
Your question was valid, and TP did nothing wrong in moving the question into an off-topic thread rather than cluttering up his thread with this. We've already had 70+ replies in this off-topic thread and only three replies in the real thread. It would have been dumb of him to NOT split it.
DoctorP
12-08-2007, 12:26 AM
Going back and reading the original thread...the only problem that I see is the decision for him to put the following section in quotes:
"Why accept a Palestinian state with a Jewish state as a neighbor when we can just hunker down and use our future majority to vote in Muslims within the democratic system?"
Even that is no big deal when I continue to read it...it is a totally acceptable thread. Not something that I am looking to discuss, but acceptable.
TheNoNamedOne
12-08-2007, 12:31 AM
It would have been dumb of him to NOT split it.
Yes. It was obvious that that is where the growth of the thread was headed, as do many threads that Muku enters to not discuss the point of the thread with me, but the right or the decision to discuss the point or bring it up for discussion.
ja_Patriot
12-08-2007, 12:32 AM
Who is the other poster you mention? TP hasn't done anything but moderate his own thread...where is the problem in that?
How about this...everyone self moderate...and also quit creating unnecessary drama! :thumbdown: I honestly think too many people hit the sauce late at night and then say...what can I do to create havoc in the forums tonight?
Pick your poison, eh, TGIF! Not happening only tonight Doc.
BTW,wasn't it really quiet when the fella was out sick with poison ivy? And the other guy is none other than eelecurb, who people refer to in here as the "clone".
Don't want to ruin your weekend. We'll manage. If you and dk could figure out a way for TP to be ignored selectively, that would help matters. It would still leave you and the almighty forumgo to notify us for violations, if any.
kombu_kid
12-08-2007, 12:37 AM
Muku, you were outraged at the discussion on Miyako, the discussion of rape, and you posted this on the Amerasian thread to TP:
First off, it has become quite obvious to me that you dont have children, or at least none that are of mixed heritage. Why you ask? Because I know of very few if any parents that refer to their own kids as being anything less than "whole".
Half is a deragatory term......(I) usually correct people when they use it.
Well, my kids are half and I'm betting there's a jillion other parents who refer to their mixed race children as "half". Yet you've already got presses rolling on "it's offensive" & "how insensitive". Now it's the Israel thing.....you may disagree with me, but I think that there wouldn't be this outrage from others without you blowing on the fire. It's starting to look like you've got "control issues" dude, telling everybody what they can talk about.
Did you not post the text back in the original thread? I am positive I remember you asking Okisteve or someone else if their response was due to what you posted in your original reply. I remember you posting the exact text in a post, and then that post dissappearing from the original thread (probably moved into here).
That is what I thought you received the warning for. Putting it back, not asking the question.
Your question was valid, and TP did nothing wrong in moving the question into an off-topic thread rather than cluttering up his thread with this. We've already had 70+ replies in this off-topic thread and only three replies in the real thread. It would have been dumb of him to NOT split it.
Yes I did,....
The question was on topic, and there was no reason to split the thread at that point after what 2 replies? One mine and the next one TP's.
He split the thread after his own reply, plus I responded to that if you look at the quote asking him to clarify what he was saying, because to me at least he sounded drunk! He modified his own post 30 minutes afterwards to correct his grammar, no biggie, but before that he had split the thread AND added other posts to the thread as well, on the off topic thread no less.
My putting it back was to keep with the continuity of the thread and in response to OkiSteve. Oh hell whatever...just take a look at the first three or four posts on this thread, and the second on on the original.
This is heavy handed moderating and also references the "slap down" that I talked about in another thread.
Muku, you were outraged at the discussion on Miyako, the discussion of rape, and you posted this on the Amerasian thread to TP:
Well, my kids are half and I'm betting there's a jillion other parents who refer to their mixed race children as "half". Yet you've already got presses rolling on "it's offensive" & "how insensitive". Now it's the Israel thing.....you may disagree with me, but I think that there wouldn't be this outrage from others without you blowing on the fire. It's starting to look like you've got "control issues" dude, telling everybody what they can talk about.
Now you are talking things out of context, I explained the rationale for that very clearly in that thread.
So I blow on the fire...however it was smoldering without any help from me.:D
We've already had 70+ replies in this off-topic thread and only three replies in the real thread. It would have been dumb of him to NOT split it.
Separate reply here to this portion.....
You know that this all came about because of the flow of the thread here.
TheLastDon
12-08-2007, 12:43 AM
We are not as free as we think we are on the net. Should somebody have told this guy to shut the hell up?
http://edition.cnn.com/2007/US/law/12/04/blog.arrest.ap/
Not that this would happen here.
TheNoNamedOne
12-08-2007, 12:44 AM
He modified his own post 30 minutes afterwards to correct his grammar, no biggie, but ...
If it is no biggie, then why bring it up?
With this Japanese notebook computer I am renting from the hotel front desk, after about 1 from the hotel front desk, after about 10 words it doubles previous 10 words, and if I words it doubles previous 10 words, and if I do not catch the previous 10 words, and if I do not catch the doubling it appears that way. Like you can see here. Idon't know how to get this bug out.
It is kinda a pain and that is why my posts are not as many as they norbally would be in such an active thread as this has become, and I would have put more as this has become, and I would have put more effort tat the same time in the original had this not beena problem.
If it is no biggie, then why bring it up?
Typical response...taking things out of the context that they were written in the first place.
To refresh your memory and anyone else just joining in here so there is no misunderstanding.
Yes I did,....
The question was on topic, and there was no reason to split the thread at that point after what 2 replies? One mine and the next one TP's.
He split the thread after his own reply, plus I responded to that if you look at the quote asking him to clarify what he was saying, because to me at least he sounded drunk! He modified his own post 30 minutes afterwards to correct his grammar, no biggie, but before that he had split the thread AND added other posts to the thread as well, on the off topic thread no less.
My putting it back was to keep with the continuity of the thread and in response to OkiSteve. Oh hell whatever...just take a look at the first three or four posts on this thread, and the second on on the original.
This is heavy handed moderating and also references the "slap down" that I talked about in another thread.
Sorry to hear about that hotel craptop! :D
TheLastDon
12-08-2007, 12:47 AM
So what was the OP a cut and paste?:rolleyes:
Opps didn't mean to be an ass.
DoctorP
12-08-2007, 12:49 AM
Sorry to hear about that hotel craptop! :D
I think it is more of a problem of chubby fingers and no built in spell check! :D
TheNoNamedOne
12-08-2007, 12:53 AM
True to that! It's almost like there's some of ya'll lying in wait to pounce on some people here like a pack o' wolves as soon as they post. And BTW, I think some people would still dog out TP if he were to continue the previous Israel thread, citing the same reasons they did for his new thread on it. It's starting to look like it's more fun for some posters here to rip people to shreds than talk about different subjects. C'mon, let's not turn on ourselves here.
This and KombuKid's other posts in this thread are just dead on. What is telling as an honest assessment of the situation by KK, is that he and I have disagreed and debated on a few threads,but he can still call it for the way it is as it regards this constant carping.
DoctorP
12-08-2007, 12:56 AM
This and KombuKid's other posts in this thread are just dead on. What is telling as an honest assessment of the situation by KK, is that he and I have disagreed and debated on a few threads,but he can still call it for the way it is as it regards this constant carping.
Careful TP...they'll acuse you of having 3 or 4 aliases...they already think you and eel are the same person! (I can vouch that they are indeed not the same!)
TheNoNamedOne
12-08-2007, 12:57 AM
I think it is more of a problem of chubby fingers and no built in spell check! :D
I wish Ihad chubbier fingers. I want to gain more weight.
It is indeed strange for me to type on a notebook comp. The keys are closer and the incline is not on the keyboard, Maybe if I put a book under it. ????
Oh, and the freakin space bar is only one inch wide. That keeps making me hit the kana henkou command. Ughhh.
This and KombuKid's other posts in this thread are just dead on. What is telling as an honest assessment of the situation by KK, is that he and I have disagreed and debated on a few threads,but he can still call it for the way it is as it regards this constant carping.
To you...there are plenty of others here besides me that know otherwise. Plus one annoying habit that you both have is taking things out of context to create your own point.
I could do the same with you but I have more respect for myself than that.
Careful TP...they'll acuse you of having 3 or 4 aliases...they already think you and eel are the same person! (I can vouch that they are indeed not the same!)
There was a time I thought the same, yet for the past few months now "we" all know they arent.
ja_Patriot
12-08-2007, 12:59 AM
Muku, you were outraged at the discussion on Miyako, the discussion of rape, and you posted this on the Amerasian thread to TP:
Well, my kids are half and I'm betting there's a jillion other parents who refer to their mixed race children as "half". Yet you've already got presses rolling on "it's offensive" & "how insensitive". Now it's the Israel thing.....you may disagree with me, but I think that there wouldn't be this outrage from others without you blowing on the fire. It's starting to look like you've got "control issues" dude, telling everybody what they can talk about.
I don't think you can single Muku out for any of those issues. It would be easy for me to sit your accusation out, but I too and some others were offended by the threads you mentioned. (Crazysix was ready to punch the shit out of a punk in the "Black are Rapists" thread.)
I don't think such discussions are necessary in a forum in paradise when there are so many issues in culture and life in Okinawa.
There are forums for "free thinkers". I'm not sure Japan Update, a commercial enterprise, intended this to be such a playground. The other problem here is we can't put certain users on an "ignore" status when they are designated as "moderator".
That term is quite an oxymoron for someone with such fringe ideas. I'm quite certain that JU will probably have to disclaim any further offensive views as being exclusively that of the poster, if it goes to extremes.
TheNoNamedOne
12-08-2007, 01:00 AM
Careful TP...they'll acuse you of having 3 or 4 aliases...they already think you and eel are the same person! (I can vouch that they are indeed not the same!)
I know, and thanks for the vouching. Even our styles are totally different.
And Eel and I do not agree on everything. The Gaia thread we debated aginsst one another and even we went against one another over AR, and perhaps one or two other topics. But when we did, we kept it quite civil.
But yeah, I knwo you can see our IPs.
TheLastDon
12-08-2007, 01:01 AM
Careful TP...they'll acuse you of having 3 or 4 aliases...they already think you and eel are the same person! (I can vouch that they are indeed not the same!)
They're not the same!?! WTF Awwwman so next you're gonna tell me that Lee Harvey Oswald definitely killed JFK and there was an actual moon landing? Just shoot down all my conspiracy theories in one night.
DoctorP
12-08-2007, 01:03 AM
Sorry to burst your bubble! :D
DocP, what is that coming out of your avatar's right eye? Did someone crap on his eye? Funny avatar... :D
TheLastDon
12-08-2007, 01:05 AM
But yeah, I knwo you can see our IPs.
Isn't that what a proxy server is for?:D
TheNoNamedOne
12-08-2007, 01:06 AM
There are forums for "free thinkers". I'm not sure Japan Update, a commercial enterprise, intended this to be such a playground. .
Then I guess the alternative is for JU to declare itself as "captive thinkers'" forum to what the majority want and no dissenting views from the sensitive and what is more in line iwth thestatus quo.
Newspapers rail at such thought, and Steve Forster, a past JU employer wrote an excellent JU story demanding that the military stop leaning on hteir reporting becuase they were reporting some dissenting views that were seen as negative on the military in the past.
I can see through your proxy! :D
TheLastDon
12-08-2007, 01:08 AM
I can see through your proxy! :D
I'm not using it now buddy, just wait.:D
DoctorP
12-08-2007, 01:08 AM
DocP, what is that coming out of your avatar's right eye? Did someone crap on his eye? Funny avatar... :D
me kuso!:D
TheLastDon
12-08-2007, 01:09 AM
me kuso!:D
Oh so it is crap it is just coming from the eye?
ja_Patriot
12-08-2007, 01:10 AM
Then I guess the alternative is for JU to declare itself as "captive thinkers'" forum to what the majority want and no dissenting views from the sensitive and what is more in line iwth thestatus quo.
Newspapers rail at such thought, and Steve Forster, a past JU employer wrote an excellent JU story demanding that the military stop leaning on hteir reporting becuase they were reporting some dissenting views that were seen as negative on the military in the past.
Or the quick solution would be to take you out as a moderator, and advise you to wisely temper your topics and curtail some of your views; problem solved in a flash.
I'm not using it now buddy, just wait.:D
Actually, I haven't installed it yet, but I found some vbulletin plug-in that supposedly sees through proxies. I don't really know how it works, but it's there. :p
I don't really see much need for it yet.
DoctorP
12-08-2007, 01:12 AM
Then I guess the alternative is for JU to declare itself as "captive thinkers'" forum to what the majority want and no dissenting views from the sensitive and what is more in line iwth thestatus quo.
Newspapers rail at such thought, and Steve Forster, a past JU employer wrote an excellent JU story demanding that the military stop leaning on hteir reporting becuase they were reporting some dissenting views that were seen as negative on the military in the past.
I know Steve...nice guy!
ja_Patriot
12-08-2007, 01:16 AM
DocP, hey where'd you get 100k points? Exec privilege? LOL
ja_Patriot
12-08-2007, 01:18 AM
In the hotel business, they say the cook eats well and the bartender gets the extra jigger. ;-)
DoctorP
12-08-2007, 01:20 AM
DocP, hey where'd you get 100k points? Exec privilege? LOL
I was at 164,000 a few minutes ago...and damn black took me down again!:scared:
TheNoNamedOne
12-08-2007, 01:20 AM
I know Steve...nice guy!
Yes, he is. And I really liked that story he wrote standing up to those trying to impose censorship on JU -- i.e. trying to keep JU reporting on sensitive topics locked into a small box. Ballzy and worthy of respect. But some here want the same clamp down on what he was reporting against.
hope he is still on island and even posibly a forum member.
TheLastDon
12-08-2007, 01:22 AM
Actually, I haven't installed it yet, but I found some vbulletin plug-in that supposedly sees through proxies. I don't really know how it works, but it's there. :p
I don't really see much need for it yet.
Well eel is already schooling some people, you might need it sooner than you think. JK:):scared::D
Yes...
http://www.anonymousproxylist.org/97-bluecoatsucks.html
kombu_kid
12-08-2007, 01:41 AM
Plus one annoying habit that you both have is taking things out of context to create your own point.
This may not be the thread you said it in, but my points here are to show you that you keep going back to a "this is offensive, that's offensive" protest over and over, and I'm giving examples of it. If I'm talking about you and things you've said, I believe quoting those things is the correct thing to do.....bringing something from another thread doesn't automatically make it "out of context" if I'm talking about statements you've made.
Well, is there any other way to look at this quote....or am I "twisting" something here? My only point is to show you that you stated that calling a mixed-race child "half" is derogatory, and that you correct people who use it. I really don't see how many other ways that statement could be viewed, other than what it says.
Half is a deragatory term......(I) usually correct people when they use it.
If there is, tell me.
kombu_kid
12-08-2007, 01:52 AM
Careful TP...they'll acuse you of having 3 or 4 aliases...they already think you and eel are the same person! (I can vouch that they are indeed not the same!)
You'll hafta excuse me, guys.......my keyboard's a little messed up today....yuk yuk:D
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