Military Youngsters going crazy

[The One]

I have been in the military for 16 years. First time being stationed in Okinawa. I am telling you that these young military guys and gals are going insane. I don't think they get that this is not the United States. This past weekend I saw a lot military guys wearing earrings in the clubs. I thought it was ok until I saw an Air Force commercial that said it wasn't ok. I saw a group of guys riding four wheeler motorcycles down 58 with no helmets or reflector vest. At the light I said to one that was closest to me. "Hope you are not in the military". He said FU and took off. Don't think I didn't try and catch that sucker. But of course too much traffic.

Maybe I didn't see it in the States. But here in Okinawa these I guess they don't make it too far in military. Carreers are ruined here and its there own fault. I heard a guy say the only way to leave the Oki an E-4 is to come here an E-5.

Should I go off base with my eyes closed. Or should I correct everyone everywhere I go. I think I should just stay away from Gate 2.

Frustrated.

[P_chan]

Oh no not earrings? Such rebels! Who knows they might start thinking for themselves. :D

I know a lot of people on this island who act really stupid. But you know what, I don't care. If they want to **** up their career then let them be. If they want to kill them self riding an ATV through town, so be it. I'm not their parents and they are all adults (or should be acting like adults) so they can take care of themselves.

Most young E2 thru E4s act like they're still in high school anyways.

[Muku]

Most young E2 thru E4s act like they're still in high school anyways.

You mean they aren't?:eek: :rolleyes: :D

[P_chan]

You mean they aren't?:eek: :rolleyes: :D

Just come by my shop, you'll see it firsthand:thumbdown:

[Boost]

Should I go off base with my eyes closed. Or should I correct everyone everywhere I go.

I think you have to take it on a case by case basis, and be more concerned about the major issues and not sweat the petty ones. More importantly, make safety issues the priority.

Riding two and four wheelers without a helmet is a safety issue. I would address that for sure. As for reflective vests...they are mandatory on-base, but I don't know how far you can really enforce it off base.

Ear rings...I know it's reg, but I never really saw the big deal in making a stink about them. I wouldn't be to concerned about them for the most part. But that's just me.

Another thing too is if you know the individuals/have any sort of personal relationship with them. If you go off trying to correct every little thing in a group of people who do not know you, it probably wont be well received and they'll just think your being an ass.

[The One]

Well yeah I understand about the earring thing. I just thought it was ok for the Air Force to wear. It just amazes me to see what these guys will do for attention. If they want to be different why don't they wear a bow tie. :)
I saw a fight on Gate two street this weekend as well. One of the guys was dressed as Fred Flinstone fighting in the middle of the street. Kind funny at first. Until they started to envolve the locals. Cars were not able to get around then they started yelling at some of the locals. Telling them to go around and of course they couldn't. I wish I had a camera to record Fred go.

[Boost]

If they want to be different why don't they wear a bow tie. :)

LoL-That would be one way. Or here's another, try to be respectable! People wont know what to think of you then! Would really have them confused. :)

[The One]

I saw this one guy walking in the middle of the street on Gate 2 again. Then this other guy told him to do him a favor and get out of the street. Really polite. This guy wanted to fight him for looking out for him. You are right because the other guy stayed polite and told him that he doesn't want to see him get hit and it is not safe. Still he wanted to fight him. He was looking for trouble. But he was not stuping to his level. He remained calm and the guy got out of the street and went on his way.
I wanted to ask the guy why did he care so much to tell him to get out of the street. But I didn't and just watched his approach to the situation.

[Boost]

You would think common sense would dictate that it is not the wisest idea to walk in the street, especially a busy street like gate 2. But unfortunately common sense doesn't always prevail and hence we have idiots like that guy.
But I guess you can't save everyone from themselves. :rolleyes:

[DocTurtle]

When in doubt, stay away from gate 2, lol. There are a lot of immature people on this island, that's for sure. And it really is a shame. I hate when I go out to eat and you can here a group of American's yelling over each other half across the place. I hate that!! Why can't you people just talk at a normal level...and yes...I said you people...as in you loud people who don't know what an indoor voice is....bastards...lol. anyways, yea. [/rant]

[OCanadaOurHomeAndNativeLand]

The problem that a lot of these guys are a danger to the community, not just themselves. Racing quads through the streets is begging for an accident (especially with cyclists & pedestrians & scooters). I've seen military personnel racing go-carts on R58. One even bounced off the tire of my car while I was waiting at a light. He was so low to the ground I didn't see him come up behind the car until after he hit me. He took off, of course, but it's only a matter of time until he hits a kid walking across the street, or an elderly person, or maybe someone on a scooter.

[atb35]

Damn, I best stay away from Gate 2 for sure. I would go ******* insane seeing that shit, and I would get in their ass for sure. Earrings I really dont care about, I would mention it because it is a reg, but the way I see it, if you want to look like a fag, knock yourself out (I know, but Im old fashioned and I will always think that way). Im surprised they dont have senior enlisted people patrolling places like Gate 2. When I was here before I used to volunteer outside Foster just walking around, popping in a bar from time to time just making sure people werent being stupid. Shame they dont have that.

[TheNoNamedOne]

I saw a group of guys riding four wheeler motorcycles down 58 with no helmets or reflector vest. At the light I said to one that was closest to me. "Hope you are not in the military". He said FU and took off. Don't think I didn't try and catch that sucker. But of course too much traffic.

And what would you have done if you had caught up to them, or even cornered them some way where you "had" them? Probably you would have demanded to see their IDs, right? But what if they refused? Off base you have no jurisdiction to detain anyone and what would happen if they were not in the least bit military related and you had tried to detain them?

What would happen to you would depend on how far that foreignor would want to push the envelope in the Jpn legal system.

I think if someone in the military were to try and correct me in Okinawa for whatever I was doing because they didn't feel it reflected well on their org or thought I was violating their regulations, I may react a tad disrespectful, too. Not sure if that would entail "F**k you!" but I wouldn't take kindly to it and perhaps not worry about the feelings of the arrogant person who thinks all foreignors they see in Okinawa are military or beholden to the rank system.

[kombu_kid]

I saw a fight on Gate two street this weekend as well. One of the guys was dressed as Fred Flinstone fighting in the middle of the street.

Man, I hate when that happens.

[kombu_kid]

I would have told the dude on the quad "hey, I betcha can't hold a wheelie all the way down the street", just to watch him eat it.\:-):thumbup:

[atb35]

I think if someone in the military were to try and correct me in Okinawa for whatever I was doing because they didn't feel it reflected well on their org or thought I was violating their regulations, I may react a tad disrespectful, too. Not sure if that would entail "F**k you!" but I wouldn't take kindly to it and perhaps not worry about the feelings of the arrogant person who thinks all foreignors they see in Okinawa are military or beholden to the rank system.

Well you could always be respectful to the person and say, "No, Im not in the miliatry" instead of being an a-hole. It shouldnt matter if someone is in the military or not, if your acting like an ass, your an ass and there is nothing wrong with someone pointing that out.

[Muku]

And what would you have done if you had caught up to them, or even cornered them some way where you "had" them? Probably you would have demanded to see their IDs, right? But what if they refused? Off base you have no jurisdiction to detain anyone and what would happen if they were not in the least bit military related and you had tried to detain them?

What would happen to you would depend on how far that foreignor would want to push the envelope in the Jpn legal system.

I think if someone in the military were to try and correct me in Okinawa for whatever I was doing because they didn't feel it reflected well on their org or thought I was violating their regulations, I may react a tad disrespectful, too. Not sure if that would entail "F**k you!".
I can see your point here however even off base the military heirarchy reigns if I am not mistaken here?

I agree that they probably couldn't do anything legally on their own off base, however if they did manage to get the personal information about these guys, even from their license plates the off base offense could be taken on base and pursued through military channels right?

but I wouldn't take kindly to it and perhaps not worry about the feelings of the arrogant person who thinks all foreignors they see in Okinawa are military or beholden to the rank system
I agree with this though.

[socalheart]

Avoid Gate 2 street on weekend nights especially. It's packed full of stupid drunk people. Unfortunately, there isn't too much you can do about military folks off base, unless it's to stop a fight or other crime. You could always take the license plate info from a vehicle whose operator is being dangerous or stupid, and turn it into PMO/SF. Heh.

On base, you can say what you want about appearance and conduct. Personally, I'd like to carry around copies of the dress code and pass them out to those people who are blatantly contrary to it. My favorite one is when you get to remind some Marine to remove his cap while indoors on base. DUH... :rolleyes:

[DocTurtle]

And what would you have done if you had caught up to them, or even cornered them some way where you "had" them? Probably you would have demanded to see their IDs, right? But what if they refused? Off base you have no jurisdiction to detain anyone and what would happen if they were not in the least bit military related and you had tried to detain them?

Well, if you think they were military, he could have caught up with them, copied down their license plate number and turned it into PMO. They even had the AFN commercials about it. So, not completely helpless. As for the demanding to see thier ID, only PMO has the right to obtain an ID from someone.

[atb35]

Well, if you think they were military, he could have caught up with them, copied down their license plate number and turned it into PMO. They even had the AFN commercials about it. So, not completely helpless. As for the demanding to see thier ID, only PMO has the right to obtain an ID from someone.

An E-1 has the right to demand to see an 0-9s ID. Whether or not they will show it is a different story, and the repricusions of such a demand Im sure would be severe.

[Fonze]

The dress code is the ****in stupidist thing in the world and that commercial is retarted. Tuck this in don't wear this with that, f-in gay IMHO.

[socalheart]

My emphasis is more on the female teenagers and "healthier" women dressing like $2 prostitutes in the commissary or food court; for example, in bikinis with wrap around-skirts or daisy duke shorts with sports bras. I'm not a guy, so am not too concerned about them. I just wish deodorant was required for them. yeech.

[The One]

Well you all are right that anyone can request an ID of someone that is being stupid or legally said, whoever falls under UCMJ. With that said I am not sure about the SOFA status. But I know that Americans that work here as civilian contractor have to follow the laws of the Okinawa. If I was able to catch up with him and found out he was in the military. I really don't know what I would have done. I.D. probably wouldn't even been on my mind.
I tell you what though, now that they at least know someone is concerned about what it is going on out there. They may think twice about riding those bikes the same way. Or they may have laughed about it and there day will come.
I will be somewhere in the BX, PX Commisary, or even Barracks and see one of these guys and let them have it. We are authorized to secure someones Off base privleges if justified.

[TheNoNamedOne]

Well, if you think they were military, he could have caught up with them, copied down their license plate number and turned it into PMO. They even had the AFN commercials about it. So, not completely helpless. As for the demanding to see thier ID, only PMO has the right to obtain an ID from someone.

I wonder how much trouble I would make for a number of Y-plater military/DOD personel for reporting license numbers for breaking traffic laws -- even when they don't. I mean, PMO would get a report, car Y plate was speeding and weaving and being dangerous on Rt58 between Foster and Lester.

I mean, does PMO actually go to these people' residences or call their 1stSgts to council these people just because someone makes an anonymous report on them? How much of a pain in the ass for the innocent people who are reported on by people just jerking the chain of the military to have fun?

Those "if you see reckless driving" spots to report them are just the greatest way to play a dirty trick on either a stranger in the military you have no relation to or someone you have something against.

[atb35]

The dress code is the ****in stupidist thing in the world and that commercial is retarted. Tuck this in don't wear this with that, f-in gay IMHO.

I couldnt disagree more. Im glad there is a dress code. I cant imagine seeing military members running around with their pants around their ankles, shirts 5x too big for them, hats worn improperly, tshirts with anarchist statements on them, underwear showing, raggedy ass clothing hanging off of them, cut-off jean shorts or any number of other dress styles that make people look completely unprofessional.

Being in the military we are supposed to look and act professional at all time, if someone doesnt like it, get the **** out!

[TheNoNamedOne]

I think they would all look more professonal if required to wear a white shirt and neck-tie for their civy attire.

While off-base enjoying their free time, why shouldn't they be allowed to dress according to local law? I don't think the rules for dress should be arbitrary. IF professionalism in civies is the goal, then like I said, neckties for everyone.

[The One]

I think they would all look more professonal if required to wear a white shirt and neck-tie for their civy attire.

While off-base enjoying their free time, why shouldn't they be allowed to dress according to local law? I don't think the rules for dress should be arbitrary. IF professionalism in civies is the goal, then like I said, neckties for everyone.

These guys will break the rules regardless. If you don't have a standard then things will be out of control. There are no individuals out there. They all dress the same. If you were to put a neck tie on everyone they will find a way to bend the rules. Then we would have to enforce that rule as well.

[Hollarey]

well, I am an avid gate 2 participate; however, I tend to stay away from the locations where the most drama occurs. What really bothers me though about all the youngens out there is that they are always trying to fight. I just dont understand why they have a desire to fight and I've noticed it is mostly marines that have this problem. I have also encountered chicks trying to pick fights with me and I just ignore it. As a teenager, I would of been knocking some asses down, but I just dont have the desire to fight with immature drunks anymore. Plus, I think about the consequences of what it could do to hubby or my ability to stay on this island.

I saw all the cop cars out gate 2 on Saturday around 3am. I didnt know what all the fuss was about. Never made it over there.

I picked up a couple guys for some friends to take to gate 2. Yeah, they were both under 20 and they were acting crazy in my van. They were throwing my stuff that was on the floor in the front to the back, kept shaking back and forth, rolled down the windows and screamed out at the locals, play fighting with each other and just overall distracting me from driving. I was getting so irritated that I had to scream at them and tell them to stop it like they were my children. I get my one night a week to go out away from the kids and I still feel like I am around them with the way military members act. Kinda sad that I have to tell a 19 and 20 year old that I am going to pull over the van if they dont stop it.

[atb35]

I think they would all look more professonal if required to wear a white shirt and neck-tie for their civy attire.

While off-base enjoying their free time, why shouldn't they be allowed to dress according to local law? I don't think the rules for dress should be arbitrary. IF professionalism in civies is the goal, then like I said, neckties for everyone.

Just so I understand you correctly...ONLY people that wear white shirts and neckties look professional?

[dk]

These guys will break the rules regardless. If you don't have a standard then things will be out of control. There are no individuals out there. They all dress the same. If you were to put a neck tie on everyone they will find a way to bend the rules. Then we would have to enforce that rule as well.
Maybe it's a rediculous rule?

This isn't the 80s. Earrings on guys are not a new thing. This has been going on for quite a while. I don't see what the big deal is about giving these kids--who are putting their life on the line--an ounce of individualism. They want to wear an earring? Let them wear an earring. They can already tatoo whatever the hell they want wherever the hell they want it. What's the difference?

Some rules deserve to be broken because they're downright retarded. If you get caught, you get caught, but if you don't there's a certain satisfaction that comes from breaking rediculous rules and getting away with it. I know this because I went to a christian college. :D

[dk]

I was getting so irritated that I had to scream at them and tell them to stop it like they were my children. I get my one night a week to go out away from the kids and I still feel like I am around them with the way military members act. Kinda sad that I have to tell a 19 and 20 year old that I am going to pull over the van if they dont stop it.
Dang, you're hanging out with the wrong people. :p

Shouldn't they be hanging out at the youth center or something?

[The One]

Maybe it's a rediculous rule?

This isn't the 80s. Earrings on guys are not a new thing. This has been going on for quite a while. I don't see what the big deal is about giving these kids--who are putting their life on the line--an ounce of individualism. They want to wear an earring? Let them wear an earring. They can already tatoo whatever the hell they want wherever the hell they want it. What's the difference?

Some rules deserve to be broken because they're downright retarded. If you get caught, you get caught, but if you don't there's a certain satisfaction that comes from breaking rediculous rules and getting away with it. I know this because I went to a christian college. :D

The tattoo rules have changed as well. You should know that everything we do is reactive to something. So there are no more tatoos that can be visible below a short sleeve shirt. Fully visible...
Thos that were in before this rule came have been grandfathered in. They had to take pictures of there current tattoos so they wouldn't go out and get more.
Getting an earring is not individualism. That is todays youth. An individual would choose not to get an earring in todays society.

[The One]

well, I am an avid gate 2 participate; however, I tend to stay away from the locations where the most drama occurs. What really bothers me though about all the youngens out there is that they are always trying to fight. I just dont understand why they have a desire to fight and I've noticed it is mostly marines that have this problem. I have also encountered chicks trying to pick fights with me and I just ignore it. As a teenager, I would of been knocking some asses down, but I just dont have the desire to fight with immature drunks anymore. Plus, I think about the consequences of what it could do to hubby or my ability to stay on this island.

I saw all the cop cars out gate 2 on Saturday around 3am. I didnt know what all the fuss was about. Never made it over there.

I picked up a couple guys for some friends to take to gate 2. Yeah, they were both under 20 and they were acting crazy in my van. They were throwing my stuff that was on the floor in the front to the back, kept shaking back and forth, rolled down the windows and screamed out at the locals, play fighting with each other and just overall distracting me from driving. I was getting so irritated that I had to scream at them and tell them to stop it like they were my children. I get my one night a week to go out away from the kids and I still feel like I am around them with the way military members act. Kinda sad that I have to tell a 19 and 20 year old that I am going to pull over the van if they dont stop it.


At 0300 saturday there was a fight on Gate 2 street. Air Force guys... One was in a Fred Flinstone costume. Pretty funny

[dk]

Getting an earring is not individualism. That is todays youth. An individual would choose not to get an earring in todays society.
Sorry, I disagree with you here. They were equally a part of my youth (90s), I just decided against ever getting anything pierced myself. It doesn't make me any more of an individual than someone who has a pierced ear. An individual makes his own decisions.

[DougP]

Yet another reason why I try to stay away from gate two. There's always a bunch of young retards out there that can't hold their liquor.

[Hollarey]

Yet another reason why I try to stay away from gate two. There's always a bunch of young retards out there that can't hold their liquor.

No Kidding!!

[TheNoNamedOne]

Just so I understand you correctly...ONLY people that wear white shirts and neckties look professional?

Not at all. However, I take it that the military has a dress code against what they feel is radical appearance. IN other words, they want their members to be more on the conservative side of appearance in the clothes they choose. If that is the case, then why not go the most conservative route, which is what they equate with "professional"? A white shirt and necktie is about as conservative as you can get.

Wouldn't that, therefore, with their reasoning be the highest standard of professionalism, and don't they want to reach that highest standard of professionalism in appearance?

[TheNoNamedOne]

Well you could always be respectful to the person and say, "No, Im not in the miliatry" instead of being an a-hole. It shouldnt matter if someone is in the military or not, if your acting like an ass, your an ass and there is nothing wrong with someone pointing that out.

Why should the innitial burden of self control be on a civilian who has nothing to do with the military when their world is touched upon by a military person? Perhaps the military person should just always know that off-base they do not have jurisdiction to question foreignors or expect them to give them an anwser.

The thing is, some people are not acting like an ass, or don't feel like they are, and so why should the perspective or feelings of some gunny be thought to be in the right for questioning the actions of a foreignor off base?

Look at it this way, how would you feel if you were Chinese American and lived in San Diego, out getting drunk with your friends, perhaps being a little loud, and just by coincidence a Chinese soldier whose ship is there in port on a friendship visit, sees you, assumes you are a Chinese soldier from his ship and then goes off on you demanding you present your ID and giving you shit and yelling at you? I think many people would probably be a little more than pissed at this arrogant behaviour from a foreign military persona and quickly tell this person what to go do with themselves.

[DougP]

Not at all. However, I take it that the military has a dress code against what they feel is radical appearance. IN other words, they want their members to be more on the conservative side of appearance in the clothes they choose. If that is the case, then why not go the most conservative route, which is what they equate with "professional"? A white shirt and necktie is about as conservative as you can get.

Wouldn't that, therefore, with their reasoning be the highest standard of professionalism, and don't they want to reach that highest standard of professionalism in appearance?

I think a better approach would be to lean more towards professional behavior rather than professional appearance. You can dress a turd up in a tux and in the end its still a piece of shit.:thumbdown: There doesn't seem to be enough pressure on how some act when off duty around here as there is on how "professional" they look. I'd rather see a SNCO chew out some guy dressed like Fred Flinstone trying to pick a fight than see one harp on a junior about an wearing an ear ring.

[socalheart]

There was (also) a stabbing on Gate 2 street this weekend. :sigh: There are just some people, male and female, who go out looking for a fight. I was never one to do the fighting thing or watch one though. Most people mellow as they get older, like cheese; they don't lose their bite, but are smarter about the biting. Uhm, it makes sense in a cheese sort of way... :o

You can dress a turd up in a tux and in the end its still a piece of shit. I think this is funny. I picture Mr. Hanky.

[keera4]

I wonder how much trouble I would make for a number of Y-plater military/DOD personel for reporting license numbers for breaking traffic laws -- even when they don't. I mean, PMO would get a report, car Y plate was speeding and weaving and being dangerous on Rt58 between Foster and Lester.

I mean, does PMO actually go to these people' residences or call their 1stSgts to council these people just because someone makes an anonymous report on them? How much of a pain in the ass for the innocent people who are reported on by people just jerking the chain of the military to have fun?

Those "if you see reckless driving" spots to report them are just the greatest way to play a dirty trick on either a stranger in the military you have no relation to or someone you have something against.



Actually, if you report reckless driving you have to give your name, because you are going to have to go to court and say what you saw. If you dont want to leave your name or information they wont take the report.

[DougP]

actually you don't always have to go to court... the MP can give you a ticket based off of the other persons statement. I know this first hand.;)

[atb35]

Look at it this way, how would you feel if you were Chinese American and lived in San Diego, out getting drunk with your friends, perhaps being a little loud, and just by coincidence a Chinese soldier whose ship is there in port on a friendship visit, sees you, assumes you are a Chinese soldier from his ship and then goes off on you demanding you present your ID and giving you shit and yelling at you? I think many people would probably be a little more than pissed at this arrogant behaviour from a foreign military persona and quickly tell this person what to go do with themselves.

WOW, talk about going to the extreme left there....why dont you use a more realistic example that would relate to what would happen with an american here. You should be writing news, you give a flawed example with only one possible outcome.

If someone came up to me right now and starts going off on me, the first thing I would say is for them to shut the f-ck up and calm down. Once he did calm down, he could ask me whatever the hell he wants and i wouldnt be offended in the least bit. In your example that chinese american shouldnt take any offense at all to a chinese soldier asking them if they are in the chinese military...why would they take offense to a harmless question?

[TheNoNamedOne]

In your example that chinese american shouldnt take any offense at all to a chinese soldier asking them if they are in the chinese military...why would they take offense to a harmless question?

Whoa! Did I miss something. Where was the part about "asking them if they were in the Chinese military"? I don't think I framed it like that, did I?

The model was that they demanded their ID or started berating them for their behaviour under the assumption that they were in the Chinese military, paralleling the point that some military persons here when seeing a foreignor out in town automatically think they are military and have a right to demand something of them based on their military status -- either modified behaviour or to show their ID to them.

The point still stands.

[P_chan]

cut-off jean shorts

Whoa I thought this was standerd civilian attire for military people? I often see guys with cut off jean shorts (or regular jean shorts for that matter) that are WAY too short. Always makes me laugh, looks like they are stuck in the 80s.

[DoctorP]

actually you don't always have to go to court... the MP can give you a ticket based off of the other persons statement. I know this first hand.;)

You may not have to go to court, but the point was that you can not make an anonymos claim. You must give your info...but then I guess if you were calling it in, you could always lie! :rolleyes:

[drinkandrun]

I can see your point here however even off base the military hierarchy reigns if I am not mistaken here?
Rank structure exists anywhere and everywhere for military personnel. Here's a good brief that will answer any questions about who can do what to whom in the military. http://www.armytoolbag.com/Tools/Classes/AuthorityJuris.ppt
Basically an officer, CWO, SNCO, or NCO can apprehend a member of the military at anytime if they are 30% certain that the member is violating the UCMJ.
However, Prosecutor makes a valid point about the manner in which these situations are handled. Often senior members of the military lose their minds and forget about tact (JJ DID TIE BUCKLE) when addressing a situation. If there is a question as to whether the person acting like a jerk is in the military, ask don't assume.

The dress code is the ****in stupidest thing in the world and that commercial is retarded. Tuck this in don't wear this with that, f-in gay IMHO.

See Article 92 of the UCMJ.

I wonder how much trouble I would make for a number of Y-plater military/DOD personel for reporting license numbers for breaking traffic laws -- even when they don't. I mean, PMO would get a report, car Y plate was speeding and weaving and being dangerous on Rt58 between Foster and Lester.

I mean, does PMO actually go to these people' residences or call their 1stSgts to council these people just because someone makes an anonymous report on them? How much of a pain in the ass for the innocent people who are reported on by people just jerking the chain of the military to have fun?

Those "if you see reckless driving" spots to report them are just the greatest way to play a dirty trick on either a stranger in the military you have no relation to or someone you have something against.

You may not have to go to court, but the point was that you can not make an anonymos claim. You must give your info...but then I guess if you were calling it in, you could always lie! :rolleyes:

I've written down the plate numbers of people driving recklessly on the freeway in San Diego. The thing is when you blaze by someone (traffic moves at 80-85mph) on a motorcycle in your camies or with your base sticker it's pretty easy to track you down. I would just have PMO run the plate and I'd call either the 1st Sgt or the XO (for officers) and let them handle it. One of the NCOs in my command was followed by the CG of I MEF, Gen Mattis, until he pulled over and the CG issued him a hind end chewing on the side of the road. We're losing plenty of people in combat, there's no need to do it on the road in the rear.
Step... I'm off the soap box, for now.

[Ammoyankee]

According to a safety letter (Joint Forces I think), quads are off limits for all SOFA personnel as there is no formal driver training offered and there have been a few accidents where military personnel were injured.

[Muku]

According to a safety letter (Joint Forces I think), quads are off limits for all SOFA personnel as there is no formal driver training offered and there have been a few accidents where military personnel were injured.
Quad as in quadracycle(sp)?

Here in Okinawa, if you are refering to those, they are quite often seen in the areas around the resort hotels. There is no requirement to have a motocycle license to drive one because technically they are not considered a motorcycle from the Japanese police.

Also there is no requirement to wear a helmet with them either. Which to me is truly dumb.

[DoctorP]

Yes, but they are still off limits, as he stated. (for SOFA personell)

[DougP]

Funny, are people that would normally be under SOFA over here be banned from riding quads in the states? I wonder?

[Muku]

Yes, but they are still off limits, as he stated. (for SOFA personell)
I think it's pretty smart too, they may have four wheels but dont look that safe, particularly at high speeds.

[Muku]

Funny, are people that would normally be under SOFA over here be banned from riding quads in the states? I wonder?
Wouldnt that depend on the licensing in the particular state?

[DougP]

who knows... Doubt they care enough state side to issue out such orders banning their personnel from riding them. I used to ride those things quite a bit back in the states and never had a license for them :) Plenty of offroad places to go. In my last unit they gave out gov licenses for the ATVs we had in our unit. I just don't see why they can't figure out a way to let SOFA people ride them around over here. Seems like they're taking the easy way out by just saying "no" you can't ride them. Might as well ban riding motorcycles as well.

[atb35]

Whoa! Did I miss something. Where was the part about "asking them if they were in the Chinese military"? I don't think I framed it like that, did I?

The model was that they demanded their ID or started berating them for their behaviour under the assumption that they were in the Chinese military, paralleling the point that some military persons here when seeing a foreignor out in town automatically think they are military and have a right to demand something of them based on their military status -- either modified behaviour or to show their ID to them.

The point still stands.

That is exactly what I was saying. The original statement was that this guy 'ASKED' if the person on the quad was in the military. He didnt demand his ID card or berate him. You gave an exmple that has only one possible outcome, and that is the person being berated would get pissed. I was saying why dont you use a realistic example instead of going completely to the left with it.

[Tempestuous]

The dress code is the ****in stupidist thing in the world and that commercial is retarted. Tuck this in don't wear this with that, f-in gay IMHO.

You know honestly I am not as concerned with off-duty dress as much as it peeves me when I see someone IN uniform that isn't following the dress code.
I just wanna blow a gasket!
I KNOW you know that you are to have a freaking cover (hat whatever the hell you wanna call it) on your gosh-darn head when you are outside walking down the street!!!!

Or that you can't wear a freaking GRAY zip up sweat shirt with your BDU's at work.
It just doesn't cut it when you see blatant disregard for the basic rules.

Out in about on your own time- just dress appropriately, have some consideration for those around you. Many of us likely don't wanna see your boob hanging out or some 80lb overweight roll of fat. :barf:

Respect yourself for cryin out loud.

[Tempestuous]

I wonder how much trouble I would make for a number of Y-plater military/DOD personel for reporting license numbers for breaking traffic laws -- even when they don't. I mean, PMO would get a report, car Y plate was speeding and weaving and being dangerous on Rt58 between Foster and Lester.

I mean, does PMO actually go to these people' residences or call their 1stSgts to council these people just because someone makes an anonymous report on them? How much of a pain in the ass for the innocent people who are reported on by people just jerking the chain of the military to have fun?

Those "if you see reckless driving" spots to report them are just the greatest way to play a dirty trick on either a stranger in the military you have no relation to or someone you have something against.

I think they put it in a file and keep it if there comes a time it can be added in to other complaints.

We sold a car and the kid was hot-roding it and someone called it in.

When we were doing something unrelated & the shirt had the file out and outta curiosity asked about the incident
(it was on a post it note or something).
We were puzzled & he told us the license number & we realized it was the sold car. We cleared it up by bringing in the bill of sale to show it wasn't us.

But had we not been in for something else....I think it was adding a kid to our orders or getting a note of approval for the kids & me to fly....and the shirts curiosity not being peeked, we would have never known about it.

I don't think they go flying out to "handle it" but may utilize it if there is a habit of such incidence or if they needed added ammunition for something else.

[Tempestuous]

Some rules deserve to be broken because they're downright retarded. If you get caught, you get caught, but if you don't there's a certain satisfaction that comes from breaking rediculous rules and getting away with it. I know this because I went to a christian college. :D

Nothing like having to run to the bathroom to remove body jewelry when they decide they want to take an x-ray you weren't expecting. :-|:D

[Ammoyankee]

I am an MSF Rider Coach here on island and the quad/go-cart issue is always addressed. Senior leadership based their decision on the fact that as stated, no license is required, no helmet is required and most quads really aren't suitable for road use. As I said, a few accidents have already occurred. As for the go-carts, personally, I think they shouldn't be allowed on the road either. Anything that can't easily be seen from another vehicle or that can literally drive up under another car should be banned.

[TheNoNamedOne]

Originally Posted by DoctorP:
Yes, but they are still off limits, as he stated. (for SOFA personell)

I think it's pretty smart too, they may have four wheels but dont look that safe, particularly at high speeds.

Perhaps the regs shouldn't outright ban their use -- just regulate how they are to be used e.g. speed.

New Regs for quad use: No speeds in excess of 30 kph.

You know, like how they don't outright ban tatoos. Just know tatoos on the face or obscene images and texts in viewable areas. But tatoos are still permitted.

[TheNoNamedOne]

I just don't see why they can't figure out a way to let SOFA people ride them around over here. Seems like they're taking the easy way out by just saying "no" you can't ride them. Might as well ban riding motorcycles as well.

I agree. Seems like a simple and common sense thing to do. Make a helmet and reflector vest the regs and let them ride the things. After all, aren't four wheels more stable than two with all othe things equal?

[TheNoNamedOne]

That is exactly what I was saying. The original statement was that this guy 'ASKED' if the person on the quad was in the military. He didnt demand his ID card or berate him. You gave an exmple that has only one possible outcome, and that is the person being berated would get pissed. I was saying why dont you use a realistic example instead of going completely to the left with it.

If you are talking about the thread starter, I don't think he asked, did he? He uttered a borderline threat, "I hope you are not in the military" or something like that. Or perhaps we are talking about two different things in this thread???

As for me, I have seen military people berate others here in public out in town. It is totally a realistic example and I gave you an constructed example that is not so fantastical to imagine to let you see how some would be pissed if some did act the way that military persons do sometimes act -- albeit in America to show how some would probably not take kindly to the shoe being on the other foot. IF you can't accept hypothetical situations as a means to look at things from different angles, well, then you are missing something important when it comes to analyzing things from different perspectives.

The funny thing is, I have also seen an Japanese American (old friend in the military) in Okinawa in civies out in town (while still on active duty) flip off an MP and in fake English accent tell MPs and other high ranking military officials to screw off. These other Americans are basically disarmed because of his ethnicity, thinking this is some Japanese local disrespectfully laying into them, but they don't do a damn thing because they know (mistakenly think) they have no jurisdiction over him because they think he is not in the military. They didn't even ask to see his ID. Now, why would they assume they have no jurisdiction or right to ask him for his ID but they would assume to do so to some white or black guy?

Rightfully so, any civilian no matter what their ethnicity when out in town should not, or would be in the right to not take kindly to arrogant presumption hoisted upon them from the military.

[atb35]

If you are talking about the thread starter, I don't think he asked, did he? He uttered a borderline threat, "I hope you are not in the military" or something like that. Or perhaps we are talking about two different things in this thread???

As for me, I have seen military people berate others here in public out in town. It is totally a realistic example and I gave you an constructed example that is not so fantastical to imagine to let you see how some would be pissed if some did act the way that military persons do sometimes act -- albeit in America to show how some would probably not take kindly to the shoe being on the other foot. IF you can't accept hypothetical situations as a means to look at things from different angles, well, then you are missing something important when it comes to analyzing things from different perspectives.

The funny thing is, I have also seen an Japanese American (old friend in the military) in Okinawa in civies out in town (while still on active duty) flip off an MP and in fake English accent tell MPs and other high ranking military officials to screw off. These other Americans are basically disarmed because of his ethnicity, thinking this is some Japanese local disrespectfully laying into them, but they don't do a damn thing because they know (mistakenly think) they have no jurisdiction over him because they think he is not in the military. They didn't even ask to see his ID. Now, why would they assume they have no jurisdiction or right to ask him for his ID but they would assume to do so to some white or black guy?

Rightfully so, any civilian no matter what their ethnicity when out in town should not, or would be in the right to not take kindly to arrogant presumption hoisted upon them from the military.

I agree with you 100% that if someone were to berate me out of the blue because of something they thought I was doing wrong, I would be pissed. I guess I just didnt understand that you were throwing a random example out there, the thread was on the topic of the gentleman who asked a guy on a quad if he was in the military, in which the guy said F-you. Your thread and example came on the heals of that conversation so i wrongfully assumed you were trying to make a comparison.

Why dont they assume everyone is in the military and question everyone? well my answer would be its racial profiling. It happens everywhere you go with every walk of life.

[TheNoNamedOne]

Fair enough, atb35.

[The One]

My question to The prosecuter is, How did you know that the person was in the military and faked. I don't understand, if you saw something like this happen and you knew what was going on and did nothing then you are partially to blame. How nice it would have been for you to stand up andd say to that senior official that the person doing something wrong is in fact in the military and you are in the right. You didn't say that this a hypothetical situation or I would understand.

I started the thread, because I was not 100% sure that they were in the military. But the odds of them being in the military or even being associated with the military is pretty high here on Okinawa. Either way a quad is an off road bike. They were coming out of a gas station to 58. No helmets no lights and just thought it was stupid thing to be doing. Just so happen that I was at the light the same time as he was. So I felt that I should say something rather than do nothing at all.

In your Chinese Military and civilian example doesn't fit this scenario. Because Americans are the only ones that will use the rules to benefit themselves. Other countries that are ran by the military would definitely I think feel a little embarassed about getting corrected by someone from his native country. Americans don't think that way. You put them on the spot, rather than them sucking it up. They want to get defensive and fight the issue at hand. Either way like you said, fake like they are not military. Or raise the BS flag because you don't have no jurisdiction over me. So that means I can be an idiot if I want to.

[TheNoNamedOne]

My question to The prosecuter is, How did you know that the person was in the military and faked.

I thought I had stated above that I knew him. Sorry if I was not clear on that.

I don't understand, if you saw something like this happen and you knew what was going on and did nothing then you are partially to blame. How nice it would have been for you to stand up andd say to that senior official that the person doing something wrong is in fact in the military and you are in the right.

Partially to blame for not getting involved? Hmmm...well, that sure can be a good topic in and of itself. Kinda like: Is withholding truth through silence wrong, and does that incur responsibility? Not sure if it is. At the moment I don't think so.

No helmets no lights and just thought it was stupid thing to be doing. Just so happen that I was at the light the same time as he was. So I felt that I should say something rather than do nothing at all.

I understand what you are saying, TheOne. However, I or any of us reading you here realy do have no way to judge how you approached them with tone of voice or style. A lot is in the delivery and the filter of many will see how you approached them different from what you thought you were doing. I have seen many arrogant E6es and Officers lose less than tact when approaching others, so it isn't such a leap for me to think that perhaps you may not have done so. If military personel are exposed to that kind of arrogant attitude while on duty on base all the time, then I would think the last time and place they want to experience that is when they are out on their free time enjoying themselves.

In your Chinese Military and civilian example doesn't fit this scenario. because American are the only ones that will use the rules to benefit themselves. Other countries that are ran by the military would definitely I think feel a little embarassed about getting corrected by someone from his native country.

This is mere conjecture, TheOne.

Americans don't think that way. You put them on the spot, rather than them sucking it up. They want to get defensive and fight the issue at hand. Either way like you said, fake like they are not military. Or raise the BS flag because you don't have no jurisdiction over me. So thiat means I can be an idiot if I want to.

Well, quite simply, yes.

That is the streak of individuality and independence in Americans that comes out of them. Looks like even boot camp indoctrination cannot wash it all out completely, huh? And why would one want it to be washed out? It is gumption and audacity -- relatives of all the characteristics that make great fighting men with a never give up attitude and a kind of spit in your face attitude at times, which while not always good, is good enough to understand that at times it is just going to be there and to try and control it totally is just going to lead to frustration.

I am wondering if your reason for starting this topic kinda smacks of frustration for really not being able to do nothing about it. 1. You couldn't catch them, and 2. From this discussion even if you had, they could still tell you to F off and you now know you would not be able to exercise any restraint over them if they merely told you they were not in the military (whether they were honest or not is irrelevant off-base).

Higher ranking military seem to get flustered when they lose control of what they want to, or think they should control.

[TheNoNamedOne]

Those who have gotten out but have gotten a job on base, have USMC tattoos on their arm, stay fit, keep a short military style haircut, must still get stopped at the PX or other places on base when they don't shave for a few days or have an earing (male).

"Hey Marine! Get back to the barracks and shave!! And get that earing out. Marines on or off duty are not permitted to wear them."

Man, to think that someone is always watching you for these petty things even when you are not one of them any longer. Is anyone here in this kind of situation? Does it bother you? Would it? How do you handle it.

I think it wouldn't bother someone at first, but if they have had a job on base for 5 years and this became a weekly occurrance, I can see how someone would get ticked by the presumption of appearance.

[The One]

What if someone got mistaken for a civilian? I have seen this a lot. That someone out of shape and longer than regulation hair. Have been accused of being a civilian. These people are offended as well. Or a Marine that has been accussed of looking like he or she is in the Navy while in Uniform. What do they do? Nothing! They don't get all butt hurt, but I tell you I bet they go and get a hair cut. Go and square away that uniform all so this will not happen again.

If a civilian works on base and gets accused of being in Military and takes offense to that. Then that is there own issues. They just have to except the fact that it will happen again again until they do something about it. Like not wear those earrings or get a haircut.

I have a friend that is a retired Marine and he has two earrings. While going through the gates in Southern California they question him all of the time. Sometimes they ask for his I.D. Once he pulls out that retired I.D. They go on there way. But if he is approached with arrogance he will give the same back. So I understand this. If that guy would have said FU I am not in the military. Then fine. He wasn't sure even if I was in the military. Maybe he said what he said because I looked like a civilian.

I started the thread because of frustration.... I am tired of the people are doing the right thing getting shit on because of those that break the rules. There was a time that military could wear earrings and maybe someone wore the earring in there uniform. There goes that. Once apon a time you could smoke Marijuana, but then people would be high at work. :) The freedoms that we have in the states are not the same abroad. We all know that! Civilian and military alike. Would it be easy to follow the rules? We are told to enforce the rules but people that think they can do what they want. Pisses me off. I am not the one that is a nit picker. It is the obvious that frustrates me.

[DougP]

Usually if someone mistakes me for being in the military I take that as a compliment. To me it means I haven't let myself go after getting out:D On the flip side though with facial hair and longer than regulation length hair cut I have I would seriously have to suggest drug testing anyone who does make that mistake.:) To me I think it sometimes has to do with a little slice of ignorance some seem to be serving every day. Some people have no idea that there might be non military Americans running around base. Or that there might be non-SOFA Americans on Okinawa. :rolleyes: The other funny thing is that Marines on Foster will call everyone a Marine when they're trying to get someone's attention.:D

[P_chan]

I have shoulder length hair and someone still made the mistake of asking if I was military LOL

Damn hippies:D

[blacktulip]

My emphasis is more on the female teenagers and "healthier" women dressing like $2 prostitutes in the commissary or food court; for example, in bikinis with wrap around-skirts

Ooooops I'm guilty of that when I drop by the supermarket on the way back from the beach. -_-"

[TheNoNamedOne]

And if they didn't dress like that, then how would we know how much they cost?

[Muku]

I have shoulder length hair and someone still made the mistake of asking if I was military LOL

Hair? Shoulder length? What's hair?:dead::old:

[P_chan]

I detect jealously :cool:

I am! Even if I could have long hair, it would be all wavy and I'd look like a girl.

[OCanadaOurHomeAndNativeLand]

Ooooops I'm guilty of that when I drop by the supermarket on the way back from the beach. -_-"
What beach and what time do you go shopping...?:D

[blacktulip]

What beach and what time do you go shopping...?:D

I'm in Australia :p

[kombu_kid]

Hair? Shoulder length? What's hair?

Dat's dat sh*t comin' outcha ears, dog! LOL :D

[The One]

These forums are great and it gives people the opportunity to voice there oppinions. Thanks for all of the great inputs and advice. Now I have to find some Civilians to yell at about there appearance. :thumbup:

[Go-Shay]

not wearing a helmet while riding a four wheeler is leagal in Japan. The four wheelers (buggy) are considered as a car because they have four wheels.

[socalheart]

Now I have to find some Civilians to yell at about there appearance. :thumbup:

Heh. If you include the locals, start with those girls who hike their skirts up to the bottom of their bottoms. :rolleyes: Then move on to those guys who are so metrosexual that they look llike the girls. :sigh:

[kombu_kid]

If you include the locals, start with those girls who hike their skirts up to the bottom of their bottoms

Whoa, whoa!!! Let's not get too hasty now!

It's things like that that make life worth livin' for us guys!!!

[P_chan]

Heh. If you include the locals, start with those girls who hike their skirts up to the bottom of their bottoms.

NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO! Short skirts=boner=happiness:first:

That is, if the woman is fine. But if her gut sticks out farther then her chest, she needs to wear a momo.

[dk]

Whoa, whoa!!! Let's not get too hasty now!

NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO! Short skirts=boner=happiness:first:

That is, if the woman is fine. But if her gut sticks out farther then her chest, she needs to wear a momo.

Heh. If you include the locals, start with those girls who hike their skirts up to the bottom of their bottoms. :rolleyes:
I agree with the two guys above. What in the world are you thinking?!!! You were this close to being banned for blasphemy!!! :army:

[FDokinawa]

I didnt read the whole thread, but to comment on the OP topic..

I understand that being overseas in the military brings its own set of issues, but I do not agree one bit with people in the military(usually higher ranked) trying to "correct" people off base. The one thing that I think you should ask yourself is.. "would I care if this was america?" If you saw a fight by a guy in a Fred Flinstone outfit in Anytown USA.. would you automaticly think it was military people and feel the need to intervene?

And as far as the guy on the quad.. same thing. You'r are probably right in assuming that he was military.. but does it really matter? If the Japanese Ploice catch him doing something stupid he will get arrested, or fined and that will trickle down to his command. Wich is somethig else I have never agreed with. If I got a ticket in the states, you pay the fine off base, and that was it. Over here you get hit twice.. ever hear of "Double jeopardy"??

And people calling PMO or fileing one of those online tickets should be punched in the nose. They are not cops, they are not trained police officers. I didnt know there was a law against "weaving in and out of traffic."? As long as I use my turn signal and have plenty of room to change lanes.. Its all personal, and people could get ****** over because some fat dependant wife is having a bad day because she had to park 20 feet from the entrance to the PX. Or hell, mabey I took her spot at the PX, so she files a complaint later in the day saying I was speeding. And for those of you that dont know, that is all it takes.. and I will recive a ticket for speeding.

Cliffnotes.. Just becuase we're not in america, dosnt mean you should think that you can do whatever you want. Off base is off base..

[Go-Shay]

I agree with FDokinawa on this one. Why is that when someone attains a certain rank they feel that they must now police anyone that looks American because they might be in the military? If you do not positively know that that individual is in the military you should just keep your comments to your self.
This is especially true if an incident (or something that you think is an incident but is not) happens off base.

[FDokinawa]

we should have kanji plates with base access stickers.. just like the states.

we should have japanese drivers licenses.. that can be revoked only by the japaense.. just like the states.

we should be denided driving privliges on base if you have to many moving violations on base.. just like the states

You should only be held acountable for what you do off base if it becomes a problem that is noticed by the japanese police.. just like the states

why is this so hard for the military to comprehend over here??

[themadscientist]

sorry, I don't agree with those who think military persons should be allowed to dress and act anyway they please. Clothing regs are warranted and should be enforced. If you are military you represent your service when you are on liberty. If you want to look like a thug or a pagan, whatever stay a civilian and do that. When you join the military you voluntarily suspend some of your rights as an individual. One of those rights is your ability to go and come as you please. it is called "liberty" for a reason, they don't have to give it to you. One of the expectations of awarding liberty is that the person will dress in a modest acceptable manner. If you are not up for the commitment don't join. The military is not a job, it is a culture.

[OCanadaOurHomeAndNativeLand]

we should have kanji plates with base access stickers.. just like the states.

we should have japanese drivers licenses.. that can be revoked only by the japaense.. just like the states.

we should be denided driving privliges on base if you have to many moving violations on base.. just like the states

You should only be held acountable for what you do off base if it becomes a problem that is noticed by the japanese police.. just like the states

why is this so hard for the military to comprehend over here??
Sounds reasonable. Any idea why that's not done?

[themadscientist]

likely because by funneling all involvement with the host nation through the base on driving issues the command has limitless power to mollest servicemembers. Can you imagine a general trying to tell LTO how to conduct business? That would be a fun phone call. :D

[FDokinawa]

Sounds reasonable. Any idea why that's not done?

No clue.. I think it stems from the fact that the military helps set SOFA policies up and like the OP has proven, high ranking people want to controll every aspect of their soilder/marine/airmen/seamens life as much as possible. And you know the japanese government wasnt going to argue against having to handle "X" number of military people trying to get drivers licenses.

I know you all have heard the saying.. "if the {insert military branch here} had wanted you to have a wife, they would have issued you one."

I understand the need to protect the militarys apperance overseas in host countries, but some of the shit they come up with is just retarded.

[The One]

I don't agree with anything FDokinawa says except maybe military folks sometime abuse there power.
But about policing our own in a country that is not ours has to happen. There are reasons for all of these rules we have to follow now. Because we are not looking out for one another.
My ententions were not bad when I spoke to the guys on the quads. I just thought it was a stupid thing to be doing. First he could get dead. If not he could get in trouble if the wrong person caught him.
We are not in America and we shouldn't bring our American (bad) ways over here. I have noticed that some will stand up for what is right. There are some that will do nothing, although they know it is wrong. They will just sit there and watch.
The Flinstone fight was comical and would have been the same in states nothing said. It may have been different if he was to fight an Okinawan. I even saw it there that night. After they finished fighting. One guy started to roudy with all of the local nationals and taxi drivers. That is when the red flag went up. People that were once spectators got envolved and made them stop.
These rules just didn't show up they are put in place for a reason. I am not justifying them either. I think they should go away after a period of time where nobody has broken them.

[The One]

After the war, until the current system was adopted in 1958, U.S. Occupation forces in Japan got A-number license plates while United Nations personnel received B-numbers. If a soldier left the service but stayed in Japan, he was issued a plate beginning with the katakana character "yo." "Why yo?" I queried, thinking to myself that yo would work for yosomono but not for Yankee. "I think it was simply that it wasn't being used yet," my source suggested. "And when we switched to letters, Y was a logical replacement for yo."

[themadscientist]

After the war, until the current system was adopted in 1958, U.S. Occupation forces in Japan got A-number license plates while United Nations personnel received B-numbers. If a soldier left the service but stayed in Japan, he was issued a plate beginning with the katakana character "yo." "Why yo?" I queried, thinking to myself that yo would work for yosomono but not for Yankee. "I think it was simply that it wasn't being used yet," my source suggested. "And when we switched to letters, Y was a logical replacement for yo."
"yo", how about "wassup"? I call them "nan-de" plates because most of the time when I see a Y plate driver do something I think "why, why did you do that"? :-|

[FDokinawa]

I don't agree with anything FDokinawa says except maybe military folks sometime abuse there power.
But about policing our own in a country that is not ours has to happen. There are reasons for all of these rules we have to follow now. Because we are not looking out for one another.
My ententions were not bad when I spoke to the guys on the quads. I just thought it was a stupid thing to be doing. First he could get dead. If not he could get in trouble if the wrong person caught him.
We are not in America and we shouldn't bring our American (bad) ways over here. I have noticed that some will stand up for what is right. There are some that will do nothing, although they know it is wrong. They will just sit there and watch.
The Flinstone fight was comical and would have been the same in states nothing said. It may have been different if he was to fight an Okinawan. I even saw it there that night. After they finished fighting. One guy started to roudy with all of the local nationals and taxi drivers. That is when the red flag went up. People that were once spectators got envolved and made them stop.
These rules just didn't show up they are put in place for a reason. I am not justifying them either. I think they should go away after a period of time where nobody has broken them.

And this statement shows your rank.

Im not saying there shouldnt be any policeing of military members by their own..

I am a civilian contractor working over here for the military. My job is very important and requires a lot of training and a clearance. And because of how the military has Nazi like control over everything on island, all it will take is for someone to call PMO and say I was doing something illegal, even if I was at home watching TV, and I will lose my job. It will cost the american tax payers a lot of money to have me replaced.

And if you think that a phone call made to PMO wont get me fired or in trouble, let me tell you a story.

We have a army guy at work that got called in for running a stop sign by another military member. The military judge that handled his "case" gave him a ticket for that. Even though he didnt run the stop sign, he even had an Staff Sgt who was driving behind him at the time tell the judge that he didnt run the stop sign. Didnt matter.. now that guy has points on his license because someone had a bad day and called PMO.

You should not have any legal rights to issue a "ticket". You have every right to call the MP's and if they catch the person in the "act" then fine. Or they can again, do what they do in the states, and just issue a warning.

I have seen to many people abuse their rank just because they are overseas.

Again, if I am off base.. F***K YOU!!

[Go-Shay]

If everyone had to take the driving test to change your state side license over to a Japanese license there would be allot of people with out licenses. The test is notorious for failing foreigners time and time again. I have know people who have failed 10 plus times. It costs about $35 each time you try.

[The One]

And this statement shows your rank.

Im not saying there shouldnt be any policeing of military members by their own..

I am a civilian contractor working over here for the military. My job is very important and requires a lot of training and a clearance. And because of how the military has Nazi like control over everything on island, all it will take is for someone to call PMO and say I was doing something illegal, even if I was at home watching TV, and I will lose my job. It will cost the american tax payers a lot of money to have me replaced.

And if you think that a phone call made to PMO wont get me fired or in trouble, let me tell you a story.

We have a army guy at work that got called in for running a stop sign by another military member. The military judge that handled his "case" gave him a ticket for that. Even though he didnt run the stop sign, he even had an Staff Sgt who was driving behind him at the time tell the judge that he didnt run the stop sign. Didnt matter.. now that guy has points on his license because someone had a bad day and called PMO.

You should not have any legal rights to issue a "ticket". You have every right to call the MP's and if they catch the person in the "act" then fine. Or they can again, do what they do in the states, and just issue a warning.

I have seen to many people abuse their rank just because they are overseas.

Again, if I am off base.. F***K YOU!!

Don't hold back, tell us how you really feel.
But that is one situation where you have experienced personally. Like I said the rules come about because someone screwed up somewhere. Reactive in nature. I said that these things should go away after awhile.
I have been here only two months and I have not heard of this call PMO thing until this thread was posted.
Civilians working for the military is a whole different story.
This forum is about Military going crazy. I will start another one about Civilians going crazy. :thumbup:

[themadscientist]

Don't hold back, tell us how you really feel.
But that is one situation where you have experienced personally. Like I said the rules come about because someone screwed up somewhere. Reactive in nature. I said that these things should go away after awhile.
I have been here only two months and I have not heard of this call PMO thing until this thread was posted.
Civilians working for the military is a whole different story.
This forum is about Military going crazy. I will start another one about Civilians going crazy. :thumbup:
Well I have been here over a decade, both green side and civilian and it happens with frequency. That is too much power to put in the hands of an average citizen. It's an entirely new category of road rage.:thumbdown:

[OCanadaOurHomeAndNativeLand]

After the war, until the current system was adopted in 1958, U.S. Occupation forces in Japan got A-number license plates while United Nations personnel received B-numbers. If a soldier left the service but stayed in Japan, he was issued a plate beginning with the katakana character "yo." "Why yo?" I queried, thinking to myself that yo would work for yosomono but not for Yankee. "I think it was simply that it wasn't being used yet," my source suggested. "And when we switched to letters, Y was a logical replacement for yo."
That sounds like a direct quote from the Japan Times:

http://search.japantimes.co.jp/cgi-bin/ek20060221wh.html

I called the U.S. Forces in Japan to see if they knew anything. I was referred to the Land, Infrastructure and Transport Ministry, the agency with jurisdiction over automobile registration. But before I got the official pass-off, some of the staffers admitted they had heard the Yankee theory, among others, but felt the explanation that made the most sense was that Y stands for Yokohama because an early licensing office was located there. I was unable to confirm that, so I moved on to the transportation ministry and was bounced all over until I reached the guy with the rule books. He searched valiantly (I could hear the pages turning while I remained on the line) but concluded there is no record within the ministry as to why the letter Y was assigned.
He did, however, have the best theory I've heard yet. After the war, until the current system was adopted in 1958, U.S. Occupation forces in Japan got A-number license plates while United Nations personnel received B-numbers. If a soldier left the service but stayed in Japan, he was issued a plate beginning with the katakana character "yo." "Why yo?" I queried, thinking to myself that yo would work for yosomono but not for Yankee. "I think it was simply that it wasn't being used yet," my source suggested. "And when we switched to letters, Y was a logical replacement for yo."

[Asshat]

That sounds like a direct quote from the Japan Times

PUNKED and OWNED!!!!

[The One]

That sounds like a direct quote from the Japan Times:

http://search.japantimes.co.jp/cgi-bin/ek20060221wh.html

Plagiarism....
Never said that I wrote it. Just something I thought I would research.

[OCanadaOurHomeAndNativeLand]

I'm sure you meant no harm. It is standard practice to use quotations and/or provide a link when using source material verbatim.

[Go-Shay]

besides my sudden craving for popcorn, I'm content in knowing that I learned something new today

[P_chan]

I forgot I was in a college debate class and everyone had to list all your sources:D

Seriously though, if you take something word for word, you should cite it. But no reason to jump down people's throats. Seems like you were trying to make him feel bad for not citing his material.

[atb35]

I didnt read the whole thread, but to comment on the OP topic..

I understand that being overseas in the military brings its own set of issues, but I do not agree one bit with people in the military(usually higher ranked) trying to "correct" people off base. The one thing that I think you should ask yourself is.. "would I care if this was america?" If you saw a fight by a guy in a Fred Flinstone outfit in Anytown USA.. would you automaticly think it was military people and feel the need to intervene?

And as far as the guy on the quad.. same thing. You'r are probably right in assuming that he was military.. but does it really matter? If the Japanese Ploice catch him doing something stupid he will get arrested, or fined and that will trickle down to his command. Wich is somethig else I have never agreed with. If I got a ticket in the states, you pay the fine off base, and that was it. Over here you get hit twice.. ever hear of "Double jeopardy"??

And people calling PMO or fileing one of those online tickets should be punched in the nose. They are not cops, they are not trained police officers. I didnt know there was a law against "weaving in and out of traffic."? As long as I use my turn signal and have plenty of room to change lanes.. Its all personal, and people could get ****** over because some fat dependant wife is having a bad day because she had to park 20 feet from the entrance to the PX. Or hell, mabey I took her spot at the PX, so she files a complaint later in the day saying I was speeding. And for those of you that dont know, that is all it takes.. and I will recive a ticket for speeding.

Cliffnotes.. Just becuase we're not in america, dosnt mean you should think that you can do whatever you want. Off base is off base..

Until I see proof of this, I will have to throw the BS flag. I find it hard to believe that PMO will recieve a call from some random person and then issue a ticket. Your second hand account of the guy running the light means nothing to me because you dont know the whole story. For all you know there could have been five other people that seen him run that light and reported him. How many civilians do you know that worked on base got kicked off for a phoned in complaint? In my years in the military, it would be easier to pull a tooth from a stranger then it is to get a civilian fired.

Because we are in a foreign country, there is MORE of a burden for people to police each other off base. Everything we do here is highlighted. Would we go up to someone in the states if we thought they were military? Damn right. Again, I wouldnt go up to someone and tell them to go shave, but I would ask if they were in the military. They could always lie, but I wouldnt know, and at least I did my part according to our regulations.

[FDokinawa]

Until I see proof of this, I will have to throw the BS flag. I find it hard to believe that PMO will recieve a call from some random person and then issue a ticket. Your second hand account of the guy running the light means nothing to me because you dont know the whole story. For all you know there could have been five other people that seen him run that light and reported him. How many civilians do you know that worked on base got kicked off for a phoned in complaint? In my years in the military, it would be easier to pull a tooth from a stranger then it is to get a civilian fired.

Because we are in a foreign country, there is MORE of a burden for people to police each other off base. Everything we do here is highlighted. Would we go up to someone in the states if we thought they were military? Damn right. Again, I wouldnt go up to someone and tell them to go shave, but I would ask if they were in the military. They could always lie, but I wouldnt know, and at least I did my part according to our regulations.

Tell you what.. give me the discription of your car and plate number and I will call you in for recless driving tomorrow and we'll see how fast PMO is knocking on your door.. Do you belive it wont happen strong enough to try me?

The guy im talking about is the nicest, slowest talking guy ive ever met. He wouldnt break the law if it was life or death. He did not run that stop sign.

And I personally have been called in.. I was leaving the shopette on foster one day when some asshat marine came up to me and asked to see my ID card.. I asked him why and he said because.. we went back and forth like that for a while when he finally said he wanted to see if I was allowed on base. So I did a quick "cop style" flash of my ID card. Just enough for him to see the giant green stripe and ask what the f**k he wanted. He then proceded to tell me that he smelled something on me. I thought he ment that I was drinking.. nope.. he thought he smelled weed on me. I proceded to go off on him for insulting me like that and told him to call the MP's right then and there so I could make him look stuipd in front of everyone at the shopette. Well he just took a long hard look at my plate number and left.

Well the next day at work, guess who rolls up? Yep, the MP's. I had myself and my car searched by a working dog infront of my peers all because some assclown "thought" he smelled weed on me. Of course my boss found out and everyone I work with found out.. I tried to play it off, but I was embarrased by the whole situation.

So if the MP's will go through all that trouble for someone saying the smelled weed on someone, do you really think they would not do the same for someone called in for recless driving or anything else?

The military has way to much power over here.. plain and simple.

[Tempestuous]

TheOne- on the subject of addressing people, one should be mindful of what you say, how you say it and to whom.

There was an IG inspector last yr, who saw people violating a reg/rule and he told them to move the car/fix the violation and he was attacked.....presumably by civilians who were sponsored on to the base he was left in a coma for two weeks and with a life long brain injury for "doing his job" as a master Sargent.

If you have the time you can look him up-
Master Sgt. Tyrone Reynolds

[Go-Shay]

TheOne- on the subject of addressing people, one should be mindful of what you say, how you say it and to whom.

There was an IG inspector last yr, who saw people violating a reg/rule and he told them to move the car/fix the violation and he was attacked.....presumably by civilians who were sponsored on to the base he was left in a coma for two weeks and with a life long brain injury for "doing his job" as a master Sargent.

If you have the time you can look him up-
Master Sgt. Tyrone Reynolds


For some reason or another I feel that there is more to this happening. I also like the way you assume that it was a civilian. However that is not the point that I would like to make. After reading though the majority of this thread I would like to say that allot of times is the way that people try to correct individuals. There are allot of senior enlisted Marines that seem to think that everyone on this Island wishes to be treated like a private. If you change your hostile approach toward people perhaps you will achieve better results without inciting an argument and or a physical fight. If you approach me with a superior attitude and or a chip on your shoulder and I do not know you of course my defenses will go up, and the out come will probably not be favorable by either party.

[Muku]

I forgot I was in a college debate class and everyone had to list all your sources:D

Seriously though, if you take something word for word, you should cite it. But no reason to jump down people's throats. Seems like you were trying to make him feel bad for not citing his material.

To the The One fyi only here:)

JapanUpdate Forum Rules (http://www.japanupdate.com/forum/announcement.php?f=36)

Look at rule number 11.


Do not post copyrighted material in full. When quoting news stories or copyrighted material, please post a link to the story. Post only the excerpts of those points which are most important for discussion.



Oh and this is also meant for reference to the post in question, by The One el's comment was appropriate imo.

[drinkandrun]

I didnt read the whole thread, but to comment on the OP topic..

I understand that being overseas in the military brings its own set of issues, but I do not agree one bit with people in the military(usually higher ranked) trying to "correct" people off base. The one thing that I think you should ask yourself is.. "would I care if this was America?" If you saw a fight by a guy in a Fred Flinstone outfit in Any town USA.. would you automatically think it was military people and feel the need to intervene?

And as far as the guy on the quad.. same thing. You're are probably right in assuming that he was military.. but does it really matter? If the Japanese Police catch him doing something stupid he will get arrested, or fined and that will trickle down to his command. Which is something else I have never agreed with. If I got a ticket in the states, you pay the fine off base, and that was it. Over here you get hit twice.. ever hear of "Double jeopardy"??

And people calling PMO or filing one of those online tickets should be punched in the nose. They are not cops, they are not trained police officers. I didnt know there was a law against "weaving in and out of traffic."? As long as I use my turn signal and have plenty of room to change lanes.. Its all personal, and people could get ****** over because some fat dependent wife is having a bad day because she had to park 20 feet from the entrance to the PX. Or hell, maybe I took her spot at the PX, so she files a complaint later in the day saying I was speeding. And for those of you that don't know, that is all it takes.. and I will receive a ticket for speeding.

Cliff notes.. Just because we're not in America, doesn't mean you should think that you can do whatever you want. Off base is off base..

I agree with FDokinawa on this one. Why is that when someone attains a certain rank they feel that they must now police anyone that looks American because they might be in the military? If you do not positively know that that individual is in the military you should just keep your comments to your self.
This is especially true if an incident (or something that you think is an incident but is not) happens off base.

we should have kanji plates with base access stickers.. just like the states.

we should have Japanese drivers licenses.. that can be revoked only by the Japanese.. just like the states.

we should be denied driving privileges on base if you have to many moving violations on base.. just like the states

You should only be held accountable for what you do off base if it becomes a problem that is noticed by the Japanese police.. just like the states

why is this so hard for the military to comprehend over here??

This is the biggest problem with Americans in general, we're a$$holes. I grew up in the west/Midwest and if someone/anyone was getting out of line, fellow citizens would call them out. This went double for kids, whenever I was caught making mischief an adult would stop me, make me fix it/clean it up, and sure as hell tell my parents. I saw a thing on TV the other night where the host was seeing if people would step up and stop him from committing a crime. The two situations were tagging a wall in broad daylight (painting "Why don't you stop me") and dropping a "roofie" in a girl's drink. Only one person, an old lady, stopped the painting and none of the young guys at the bar stopped the roofie (the guys thought it was "Awesome":thumbdown: ) The point is that if we as citizens don't step up and stop what we know is wrong, our society is going to degrade and eventually collapse.
This goes double for the military members. Like the man says "you can give your heart to Jesus, but your ass belongs to the Corps". I'll agree that you need to be tactful when approaching people, especially in dangerous situations like Fred Flintstone, but to stop someone you know is screwing up is a moral imperative. It's a bit easier to spot the Marines, who would cut their hair like that if they didn't have to :w00t:, but it goes for all members. It's not just a job, it's an adventure:rolleyes:, you give up your individuality and your independence when you join the military. Accept it or get out.
FD you sound like you may have had some negative experiences with members and for that I apologize. It doesn't sound like you lack assertiveness so did you ask PMO why they were there or who reported you? One of the rights that even military members don't give up is the right to confront their accuser. If anyone tells you differently you should speak to their boss and take it up the chain until you get an answer. If you're unwilling to take the steps necessary to rectify the situation, you give up your right to bitch. Secondly, if you despise the military culture so much why do you continue to get paid by them? It's just like the guys who always bitch about the military but keep re-enlisting. When addressing their complaints I like to paraphrase coach Dan Hawkins from CU:
"IT'S THE UNITED STATES MILITARY! IT'S THE (insert service here)! If you don't like it... Go work at Dairy Queen. Go work at Dairy Queen brotha."

[FDokinawa]

FD you sound like you may have had some negative experiences with members and for that I apologize. It doesn't sound like you lack assertiveness so did you ask PMO why they were there or who reported you? One of the rights that even military members don't give up is the right to confront their accuser. If anyone tells you differently you should speak to their boss and take it up the chain until you get an answer. If you're unwilling to take the steps necessary to rectify the situation, you give up your right to bitch. Secondly, if you despise the military culture so much why do you continue to get paid by them? It's just like the guys who always bitch about the military but keep re-enlisting. When addressing their complaints I like to paraphrase coach Dan Hawkins from CU:
"IT'S THE UNITED STATES MILITARY! IT'S THE (insert service here)! If you don't like it... Go work at Dairy Queen. Go work at Dairy Queen brotha."

Yea I had some negitive experiances.. 8 Years in the army. 5 of them over here having to put up with marines yelling at me for wearing a hat in the PX or not having a belt on.. ext.

Marines are trained at a low rank to make sure everyone around them is "right". And this is what leads to people like the guy that confronted me at the shopette. While I was in the army over here I was "yelled" at many times buy people that took what they viewed as me doing something wrong as a personal attack on them. Its over kill and not needed.

As for the guy that "turned" me in.. yea, I asked the MP's if I could know who he was and what exactly was said, or if I had any recourse against him. Nope, not a damn thing I could do.. So yea, I'd love to live in the happy world you do where the military has to follow the law.. but unfortunatly they dont.

[drinkandrun]

Yea I had some negitive experiances.. 8 Years in the army. 5 of them over here having to put up with marines yelling at me for wearing a hat in the PX or not having a belt on.. ext.

Marines are trained at a low rank to make sure everyone around them is "right". And this is what leads to people like the guy that confronted me at the shopette. While I was in the army over here I was "yelled" at many times buy people that took what they viewed as me doing something wrong as a personal attack on them. Its over kill and not needed.

As for the guy that "turned" me in.. yea, I asked the MP's if I could know who he was and what exactly was said, or if I had any recourse against him. Nope, not a damn thing I could do.. So yea, I'd love to live in the happy world you do where the military has to follow the law.. but unfortunatly they dont.
Did you take it higher than those MPs? I find it hard to believe that you pursued this as high as the Provost Martial or base CO and didn't receive satisfaction for being embarrassed and falsely accused. I've found that it's often a lack of willingness to right a wrong that causes bitterness. It's about conviction and stubbornness, I'm the first one to say that people at low levels will give you the answer that will cause them the least amount of hassle. My rule of thumb is to talk to the supervisor of the first two people I talk to, it reaps benefits when you talk to customer service anywhere.
Second, if you're so fed up with the military why keep cashing the checks? I'm sure you could find a comparable job that doesn't require on base work. Especially with the Iran talk, defense is booming. You choose to be miserable by working directly near people you seem to despise.

[FDokinawa]

Did you take it higher than those MPs? I find it hard to believe that you pursued this as high as the Provost Martial or base CO and didn't receive satisfaction for being embarrassed and falsely accused. I've found that it's often a lack of willingness to right a wrong that causes bitterness. It's about conviction and stubbornness, I'm the first one to say that people at low levels will give you the answer that will cause them the least amount of hassle. My rule of thumb is to talk to the supervisor of the first two people I talk to, it reaps benefits when you talk to customer service anywhere.
Second, if you're so fed up with the military why keep cashing the checks? I'm sure you could find a comparable job that doesn't require on base work. Especially with the Iran talk, defense is booming. You choose to be miserable by working directly near people you seem to despise.

I only despise the ones that feel they need to push their "values" onto me. I have lots of military friends, I love okinawa, and I like the Army people I work with.

And you honestly think that the people that implemented the "Call us anytime about any crime" would be willing to accept that their system is faulted? You know damn well they would have made some bullshit comment about every now and then an inoccent person is accused, but it dosnt make the system bad. What do you think would happen when you let untrained people have the power of cops?? Hell we all know most cops cant even do their job right, let alone some 23 year old buck Staff Sgt with something to prove.

[Hollarey]

Spending my usual night out gate 2..yeah...I got to sing my karaoke. Well, I go and visit Jimmy(the drunk) next to Club red and he ask me to sit with him. I start conversing with other Americans sitting around him and this one guy as me what branch I am in. I tell him Air Force and he doesnt say a word. However, he asks some guys walking down the street what branch they were in. He was asking everyone pretty much. Well, some guys said Air Force and then he starts booing and calling Air Force pussies and so forth. I asked him why it matters to him what branch everyone is in and he said he was a Marine and that they were better than any branch especially Air Force. I sorta went off on him and told him that he should respect his fellow military members regardless of what branch they are in. We are all U.S. military here in a foreign country but all this guy wanted to do was single the different branches out and cause drama. He was a young guy so he was just showing his immaturity but I see this soooo much everywhere on this island. Why is it so hard to support each other? We are all doing the same thing regardless if someone is Army, Airforce, Navy or Marines.

[DougP]

Until I see proof of this, I will have to throw the BS flag. I find it hard to believe that PMO will recieve a call from some random person and then issue a ticket. Your second hand account of the guy running the light means nothing to me because you dont know the whole story. For all you know there could have been five other people that seen him run that light and reported him. How many civilians do you know that worked on base got kicked off for a phoned in complaint? In my years in the military, it would be easier to pull a tooth from a stranger then it is to get a civilian fired.

Because we are in a foreign country, there is MORE of a burden for people to police each other off base. Everything we do here is highlighted. Would we go up to someone in the states if we thought they were military? Damn right. Again, I wouldnt go up to someone and tell them to go shave, but I would ask if they were in the military. They could always lie, but I wouldnt know, and at least I did my part according to our regulations.

Shit happened to me once. Some fat prick AF lady called PMO saying my friend and I were racing on base(kadena) How we were accomplishing this while we were stopping at every light and I was following him because I had forgotten where Clothing and Sales was:D But that's all it took... one phone call and I spent 3 hours at PMO and got a ticket... Now go ahead and tell me I'm bullshitting:) Phone calls and false accusations can ruin anyones career or day in the military community. I don't doubt this for a second.:thumbdown:

[OCanadaOurHomeAndNativeLand]

The point is that if we as citizens don't step up and stop what we know is wrong, our society is going to degrade and eventually collapse.

Like it says in War and Peace, "All that is necessary for evil to triumph is for good men to do nothing."

[TheNoNamedOne]

Like it says in War and Peace, "All that is necessary for evil to triumph is for good men to do nothing."

I wholey agree with this. Tolstoy (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Leo_Tolstoy#Pacifism)(check out the last sentence in that link on Tolstoy) had a profound affect on Ghandhi with his philosophy on nonviolence. Active direct action seems to be a contradiction of pacifism, doesn't it. Perhaps pacifism is direct action.

[FDokinawa]

Like it says in War and Peace, "All that is necessary for evil to triumph is for good men to do nothing."

"All that is necessary stupidity to triumph is for dumb people to be put in a position of power" - Me

[Tempestuous]

I also like the way you assume that it was a civilian. However .
According to every report that I have read- it was said to be civilians that were sponsored onto the base.
I was not assuming, but repeating what was reported.

[OCanadaOurHomeAndNativeLand]

I wholey agree with this. Tolstoy (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Leo_Tolstoy#Pacifism)(check out the last sentence in that link on Tolstoy) had a profound affect on Ghandhi with his philosophy on nonviolence. Active direct action seems to be a contradiction of pacifism, doesn't it. Perhaps pacifism is direct action.
Ghandi was quite explicit that he was not a pacifist, and his work was not pacifism. He called it active non-violent resistance. He and his followers were very actively resisting injustices, but they refused to stoop to using violence as a solution.

[OCanadaOurHomeAndNativeLand]

i have been pwnd in debate
No excuse for lying in your sig. Man up and move on.

[The One]

Tell you what.. give me the discription of your car and plate number and I will call you in for recless driving tomorrow and we'll see how fast PMO is knocking on your door.. Do you belive it wont happen strong enough to try me?

The guy im talking about is the nicest, slowest talking guy ive ever met. He wouldnt break the law if it was life or death. He did not run that stop sign.

And I personally have been called in.. I was leaving the shopette on foster one day when some asshat marine came up to me and asked to see my ID card.. I asked him why and he said because.. we went back and forth like that for a while when he finally said he wanted to see if I was allowed on base. So I did a quick "cop style" flash of my ID card. Just enough for him to see the giant green stripe and ask what the f**k he wanted. He then proceded to tell me that he smelled something on me. I thought he ment that I was drinking.. nope.. he thought he smelled weed on me. I proceded to go off on him for insulting me like that and told him to call the MP's right then and there so I could make him look stuipd in front of everyone at the shopette. Well he just took a long hard look at my plate number and left.

Well the next day at work, guess who rolls up? Yep, the MP's. I had myself and my car searched by a working dog infront of my peers all because some assclown "thought" he smelled weed on me. Of course my boss found out and everyone I work with found out.. I tried to play it off, but I was embarrased by the whole situation.

So if the MP's will go through all that trouble for someone saying the smelled weed on someone, do you really think they would not do the same for someone called in for recless driving or anything else?

The military has way to much power over here.. plain and simple.

Looks as if he got the last laugh. Why couldn't you just be polite and say that you have not been smoking weed and showed your id. Then called the PMO on him. But you never know who you are talking to. He probably worked for PMO.

[The One]

To the The One fyi only here:)

JapanUpdate Forum Rules (http://www.japanupdate.com/forum/announcement.php?f=36)

Look at rule number 11.





Oh and this is also meant for reference to the post in question, by The One el's comment was appropriate imo.

I didn't post the content in whole. I have never read the rules. Oops my bad....

[FDokinawa]

Looks as if he got the last laugh. Why couldn't you just be polite and say that you have not been smoking weed and showed your id. Then called the PMO on him. But you never know who you are talking to. He probably worked for PMO.

I wasnt polite to him, because he wasnt polite to me. I dont like it when people come up and ask to see my ID with an attitude. If he would have said

"excuse me sir, I was just wondering if I could see your ID? Here is mine. My name is Smith. I was wondering if I could ask you a question? I have this supper K-9 like nose that can smell drugs on cars.. and it almost smells like you have weed in your car. Do you?"

But he didnt.. he was a asshole, so I was an asshole back.

I am a civilian.. go-t, semi long hair. That right there should have been enough for him to forget the whole matter and walk away. we civilians dont like to be ****** with. and you can take the whole.. "if you dont like it get another job" speech and shove it. Im making damn good money, and I get to still serve my country. I love the job, not the retards on base.

And I'd like to give you a big THANK YOU!! for defending my right to tell people like that to F**K OFF!

[The One]

I wasnt polite to him, because he wasnt polite to me. I dont like it when people come up and ask to see my ID with an attitude. If he would have said

"excuse me sir, I was just wondering if I could see your ID? Here is mine. My name is Smith. I was wondering if I could ask you a question? I have this supper K-9 like nose that can smell drugs on cars.. and it almost smells like you have weed in your car. Do you?"

But he didnt.. he was a asshole, so I was an asshole back.

I am a civilian.. go-t, semi long hair. That right there should have been enough for him to forget the whole matter and walk away. we civilians dont like to be ****** with. and you can take the whole.. "if you dont like it get another job" speech and shove it. Im making damn good money, and I get to still serve my country. I love the job, not the retards on base.

And I'd like to give you a big THANK YOU!! for defending my right to tell people like that to F**K OFF!

I came from Camp Pendleton and a Command that employs many civilians. Our civilians fall under the Commanding Officer of the unit. So with that said coming through the gate of MC Base. You as a civilian must fall under the same regulations as the active duty military personnel. I am not talking about military customs and courtesy. I am talking about the UCMJ and civil laws.

We had one civilian we caught doing random inspections on vehicles. Every five vehicles or so. Mostly civilians, I don't know why that worked out that way. But we caught a guy with a pistol in his car. No concealed weapons permit or nothing. So it was confiscated by the C.O. direction.
The next day the C.O. gave orders for us to inspect the same civilian. This time we found Marijuana and rounds for the same pistol. He thought he didn't fall under the same rules and regulations as everyone else. PMO was called and they escorted this guy to the gate and handed him over to the local authorities. This guy was very disgruntled after the fact. But I am not sure how long he has been working for DOD. But his days came to an end really quick.

I think courtesies go both ways and we as humans really need to know how and when to be respectful. I know that maybe I would have reacted the same way as you did. Buy after thinking about it. That is a very serious accusation. So this military guy that thought he smelled marijuana had every right to act. Although he was disrespectful it doesn't grant disrespect back. So that is why he probably did what he did. He probable thought you were being defensive for a reason.

Police officers are disrespectful all of the time. But everyone always says, "yes sir, no sir". Then aftwards ask for Badge numbers... I know that situation dictates. It just depends on how far one is willing to go. Everybody has experieced negativity and it seems that with you negative thoughts about the assholes in uniform. You time working with the military would be better served if you had a better attitude for the military lifestyle. Too much time wasted trying to fight what is the right.

[socalheart]

Police officers are disrespectful all of the time.

I've never had an experience with an impolite police officer, either American (military) or Japanese. (knock on wood) I was pulled over by the JP once. The officer who got out to ask me questions was nice, but the one who stayed in the car on my passenger side where my husband sat was very rude to him. I've been interviewed (interrogated?) by military police before, and they were always nice to me. Then again, in each case, I've been innocent of any actual crime.
:D

[atb35]

Ok, well I did check into the issue about getting a ticket via someones phone call. According to the PMO on Camp Foster, that isnt possible. They stated they would need to witness the infraction or in the case of speeding, they have to have a radar gun confirmation to issue a ticket.
For those of you who state it happened to you, hmm, dont know what to tell you. Perhaps you should have taken it up the chain of command. To me, that seemed rediculous so I looked into it, maybe the person getting the ticket should have as well.
BTW, dont badger me about this, I got my information from the folks that issue the tickets for Marine bases, maybe Army and Air Force bases are different, I didnt call them.

[themadscientist]

I forced the issue the matter dropped in my case.

[atb35]

Honestly i cant see any other possible outcome unless they had numerous witnesses that testified you were in the wrong. One call for a ticket, i dont buy it...definately not if it was taken to court.

[TheNoNamedOne]

Let's test the system with reporting Y plates anonymously.

Someone call PMO and report your own plates as speeding and weaving somewhere off-base and see what they tell you and if you need to identify yourself for them to take action.

If they do, then just hang up.

[OCanadaOurHomeAndNativeLand]

I wasnt polite to him, because he wasnt polite to me...
Been there. done that!:D

<muttering to self>: a kind word turneth away wrath, a kind word...

[FDokinawa]

The One.. those civilians are called GS civilians, and yes, they are just like the military in regular cloths. I am a contractor.. I work for a company in america. The only way to get to me is by banning me from base.

My issue with the situation is not that I was confronted, but the fact that you guys feel the need to confront people. I was in the army for 8 years, I had to work with my share of puffed up chest thumpers that wouldnt amount to shit if they got out of the military. They also felt the need to make sure everyone around them was misirable too.

If I drive onto base, I have no problems with MPs doing random searches on my car. I have no problem if the base commander is standing at the gate and points at my car and inspects it himself. I do have a problem with someone trying to "do the right thing". Its a very fine line.. i know. And since your in the military, im pretty sure you cant see that line anymore.


atb35.. you just proved me right. I call up PMO and say you were driving wrecklessly down 58. They say, ok, whats my information, would I be willing to show up in court? Yep, no problem. I show up in court saying you were swerving in and out of traffic.. bam you just got a ticket. I'm not a cop, Ive never been trained on driving laws, yet I just gave you a ticket. sound fair?
Like I said to The One.. its not your job to police people. Military over here think they are cops... they're not.

[The One]

The One.. those civilians are called GS civilians, and yes, they are just like the military in regular cloths. I am a contractor.. I work for a company in america. The only way to get to me is by banning me from base.

My issue with the situation is not that I was confronted, but the fact that you guys feel the need to confront people. I was in the army for 8 years, I had to work with my share of puffed up chest thumpers that wouldnt amount to shit if they got out of the military. They also felt the need to make sure everyone around them was misirable too.

If I drive onto base, I have no problems with MPs doing random searches on my car. I have no problem if the base commander is standing at the gate and points at my car and inspects it himself. I do have a problem with someone trying to "do the right thing". Its a very fine line.. i know. And since your in the military, im pretty sure you cant see that line anymore.


atb35.. you just proved me right. I call up PMO and say you were driving wrecklessly down 58. They say, ok, whats my information, would I be willing to show up in court? Yep, no problem. I show up in court saying you were swerving in and out of traffic.. bam you just got a ticket. I'm not a cop, Ive never been trained on driving laws, yet I just gave you a ticket. sound fair?
Like I said to The One.. its not your job to police people. Military over here think they are cops... they're not.

FDOkinawa,
Where I worked we had GS and Contractors working aboard Camp Pendleton. So I know the difference.
Alls I have to say is that there are more people getting caught breaking the rules than those getting falsely accussed. It is just sad when a civilian working aboard a military installation gets upset for looking like ass. Protect his rights to look like ass should we. Should we stop because we may hurt someones feelings? I don't think so! We keep doing what we are supposed to do. The system is not perfect.
I used to think wearing a cover in the car while driving was a stupid rule. But I had to follow it and enforce it. I am not going to lye. When I got off base that cover right off my head. But if someone in the service saw me driving and corrected me on the spot. I would just put it on because I knew I was wrong and nothing said. Now that rule has changed. :thumbup:

[Tanimaga]

It is just sad when a civilian working aboard a military installation gets upset for looking like ass. Protect his rights to look like ass should we. Should we stop because we may hurt someones feelings?


What do you mean by "looking like ass"?

[Bones]

Posted by Tanimaga:

What do you mean by "looking like ass"?

Just guessing, but being a retired military member myself, as well as a former contractor, I'll offer my one yen worth. I'm sure to be corrected if wrong. :old:

There are people out there, who seem to think that just because they are not military anymore, and since they live in a foreign country, they can do anything their hearts desire. For the sake of argument, let's say these people live on Okinawa.

Many active duty personell, seem to to think it applies to them as well. They are military, they are special, normal laws just don't apply to them, or their dependents.

So like FD, he gets caught doing something wrong, and gets punished. Sort of like dependent who gets stopped for a lot of traffic violations, and each time say: "I didn't know".

Yeah, like that's going to make the ticket go away. :rolleyes:

NBTP

[Tanimaga]

More acting like ass then. I can understand this..I deal with youngsters who seem to like to think they run things.

I don't think FD got caught doing anything bad..just had understandable gripes about how he was approached. I myself wouldn't take kindly to an accusation like that one. The man works at a high security area..even an hint of something like that could hurt a clearance.

The thread originated about a guy riding a 4wheeler off base with no vest..helmet..what have you. If the guy was within Japanese guidelines (which means you don't need a helmet, vest, or safety gear), I don't see a problem. These vehicles can be rented at many places, and require only a regular drivers liscense. They are registered and liscensed for the road. Is it safe? Nope. Neither is a bike for that matter. Navy and Marine branches have banned their use, but (I believe) Air Force has not, but they are not allowed to be driven on the roads on base. If the rules have changed recently, I'm not aware.

[FDokinawa]

The whole point I was initially trying to get accross was that just beacuse we are overseas, military commanders and other people with rank seem to think that they are the law on and off base. As soon as I or anyone else steps foot off the base no one other than Japanese police should be able to stop, detain or ask to see my ID card. If I am breaking the law and you see it, call the Japanese police.. if you cant speak japanese, then tell the MP's to call the Japanese police.

atb35... I dont know what happend to it, but there used to be a link on the USMC okinawa web page that had a form you could fill out to turn someone in for a moving violation. And like I stated before.. we have an army guy at work that got called in and given a ticket because someone supposedly saw him run a stop sign. This is not made up, im not saying this just to say it. The guy never ran the stop sign, other people saw him NOT do it.

[The One]

The whole point I was initially trying to get accross was that just beacuse we are overseas, military commanders and other people with rank seem to think that they are the law on and off base. As soon as I or anyone else steps foot off the base no one other than Japanese police should be able to stop, detain or ask to see my ID card. If I am breaking the law and you see it, call the Japanese police.. if you cant speak japanese, then tell the MP's to call the Japanese police.

atb35... I dont know what happend to it, but there used to be a link on the USMC okinawa web page that had a form you could fill out to turn someone in for a moving violation. And like I stated before.. we have an army guy at work that got called in and given a ticket because someone supposedly saw him run a stop sign. This is not made up, im not saying this just to say it. The guy never ran the stop sign, other people saw him NOT do it.

You are wrong once again. On or off base doesn't matter where the military person is. If something was to happen off base, do you know what will happen to the senior person present when the incident occurred? He is treated like he commited the crime himself. That is one of the purposes of rank structure. You will be held responsible if you see something that happened to a military person and you do nothing about it. Period...

[FDokinawa]

You are wrong once again. On or off base doesn't matter where the military person is. If something was to happen off base, do you know what will happen to the senior person present when the incident occurred? He is treated like he commited the crime himself. That is one of the purposes of rank structure. You will be held responsible if you see something that happened to a military person and you do nothing about it. Period...

And I know this.. now.. what if you were in the states and the same incident happened, would you still be held accountable? Example: your at a bar having a drink. Two young "men" get into a fight and tear the place up. You as a senior person was there.. its your fault right?

[The One]

And I know this.. now.. what if you were in the states and the same incident happened, would you still be held accountable? Example: your at a bar having a drink. Two young "men" get into a fight and tear the place up. You as a senior person was there.. its your fault right?

That is too vague. If you out and you aware of the two individuals are in the military and are junior. If you say nothing then know one will know that you are there. But if the individuals called you as witness because they knew that you were there. Then the Commanding Officer can hold you responsible. No NJP or Courts Martial. Maybe just an ass chewing.
That is why most try and do something rather than do nothing. When in doubt do something about it. Right? Situation will dictate.
But you bet your bottom that if they are in your charge, wherever you are. On base, off base or foreign land. Something goes down and senior man will be standing on the carpet in front of the man.
I was the senior military rep once in Colorado springs. I had a Marine get jumped in the parking lot while walking a young lady to her car. Our Commanding Officer came out from California to check on the Marine because he was put in the hospital. After that the C.O. came to see me.
He asked about what happened. I told him...
Then he proceded to explain his personal philosophy about clubs. He told me that I should have left the club early to avoid fights. That I could have done something to prevent this from happening. We could have stayed together. The Marine was young and this would have probably been his first time with a woman. So I told him I was happy for him. Then you know what the CO asked me? He asked me did I give him some protection (condoms). I was pretty dumbfounded. But because I was the senior man present he felt that I was responsible and he let me know it.

[atb35]

atb35.. you just proved me right. I call up PMO and say you were driving wrecklessly down 58. They say, ok, whats my information, would I be willing to show up in court? Yep, no problem. I show up in court saying you were swerving in and out of traffic.. bam you just got a ticket. I'm not a cop, Ive never been trained on driving laws, yet I just gave you a ticket. sound fair?
Like I said to The One.. its not your job to police people. Military over here think they are cops... they're not.

My appologies...I didnt realize you were more athoratative then the PMO. According to them, that cant happen, but you state otherwise.....

[atb35]

And I know this.. now.. what if you were in the states and the same incident happened, would you still be held accountable? Example: your at a bar having a drink. Two young "men" get into a fight and tear the place up. You as a senior person was there.. its your fault right?

If you knew the people getting in a fight were military, yes, you would be held accountable. Considering you were in the military for eight years, you should know this. Perhaps the Army or Air Force doesnt push their members to look out for each other like the Navy/Marine Corps does, I dont know.

We are all responsible for each other at all times, on base, off base, in a foreign country, on ships, in space...anywhere at anytime. I wouldnt expect civilians to understand or like the idea of it, and for the military folks who dont like it, well shit, get out and be a civilian. One of the best things I like about the military is the community. I fully expect that if I was in the middle of bumfu_k nowhere and I needed help, that a fellow service member would be there for me. I dont even dream of hoping that from a civilian. Part of that expectation is the responsibility to look out for each other.

[DougP]

Funny, it was usually stuff like fights, destroying property, and just good ol' caveman like behavior that went unchecked by seniors out in town.. Now ear rings and unauthorized clothing on another hand, look out :D I noticed some fellow senior NCOs go off on some juniors when I was in(the service) over some stupid shit like wearing a tank top. However when out with the same senior folk and a fight broke out they were the last to step in. It let me know where some peoples real "values" lie. Oh I've seen quite a few of these ass chewings over nothing that could have been handled with a little bit of tact. Save the yelling and arm flailing for the real serious shit.

Glad I'm out and I don't have to deal with that kinda crap anymore. Now I'm all for keeping your fellow man straight. I just wish this supposed official rule went in to place on the weekends around certain watering holes. The same guy who yelled at some junior marine for wearing a hat into the PX is the guy doing body shots off some E-2 female while stripping. Oh yeah :D

[FDokinawa]

I was drving a truck into Iraq the day the war started.. I had missiles flying over head the whole night before we went in. Had to drive in full mop gear for 20+ hours.. so please go take your HOORA attitude somewhere else.

atb35.. how long have you been on island? you seem to know everything about everything.. and you continue to imply that I dont have a clue about calling PMO. Like I've stated a couple of times.. A marine on Camp Foster called PMO a few months ago on an Army Specialist that works with me. This marine told PMO that the said Specialist(E-4) ran the stop sign by the Globe and Anchor gate. And altho there were other witnesses that said he didnt run the stop sign, he recieved a ticket for running it. Do you need a scanned copy of the ticket? or do you still think im lying? I dont give a F**K what PMO told you.. they are lying. Or they recently changed their policy on this. Because again, like I said before, they had a link on the USMC Okinawa web site that you could click and fill out a report on someone and that person would be called into court. And if you showed up and stated that you saw that persone doing something illegal "as per you" that person got a ticket. I'm very happy to hear that PMO has changed that policy, so now I can drive safe knowing that some officers wife cant turn me in for taking her parking spot at the PX.

[DougP]

I also stated that something similar to that happened to me too. Although that was a little over 4 years ago :)

[FDokinawa]

I dont know why these guys, that are pushing the whole "need to police each other" views, find it hard that there was a program in place that allowed anyone to call PMO and issue a ticket.

Mabey they realize that something like that gives the wrong people to much power. Its bad enough that we have to put up with high ranking military wives thinking they have the same "power" as their husbands.

Reminds me of a story I was once told..

At a large Army base in the states. There was an above average number of officer and sienor enlisted wives that were "correcting" young enlisted soldiers about their apperance. Well after a while the base Sergeant Major decided to do something about it. So he asked all the officer and senior enlisted wives to a meeting at the base theater. He stood up in front of them all and asked them to please sit in order of rank. After a good long while of moving and argueing of who our ranked who, they finally got settled down. The Sergeant Major then told them, "None of you have rank! Your husbands do!" and walked off the stage.

Moral of the story.. just becasue you think your right.. dosnt mean you really are.

[P_chan]

If someone is really driving unsafely or doing something unsafe that is truely endangering others lives, then I don't have a problem with someone calling PMO or the SPs on them. Now if it's nothing really major (like a rolling stop at a stop sign) then I don't think you should be policing them. Actually, I think it's kinda nosy in some cases.

[Muku]

At a large Army base in the states. There was an above average number of officer and sienor enlisted wives that were "correcting" young enlisted soldiers about their apperance. Well after a while the base Sergeant Major decided to do something about it. So he asked all the officer and senior enlisted wives to a meeting at the base theater. He stood up in front of them all and asked them to please sit in order of rank. After a good long while of moving and argueing of who our ranked who, they finally got settled down. The Sergeant Major then told them, "None of you have rank! Your husbands do!" and walked off the stage.

Moral of the story.. just becasue you think your right.. dosnt mean you really are.
Dont take this wrong here please....

This story sounds like the stuff of "Urban Legends":D

Reminds me of a story I was once told..
Did you believe it when you heard it?

[P_chan]

I've been to and officer's spouse meeting before, it was freaking ridiculous:barf:

[OCanadaOurHomeAndNativeLand]

Dont take this wrong here please....

This story sounds like the stuff of "Urban Legends":D
A valid point made by FDo whether or not the story is real:thumbup1:

[OCanadaOurHomeAndNativeLand]

just had to make a comment

Yeah, I enjoy the banter here:thumbup1:

[Bones]

As posted by P_Chan:

Now if it's nothing really major (like a rolling stop at a stop sign) then I don't think you should be policing them. Actually, I think it's kinda nosy in some cases.

I'll agree with you up to a point, but if someone is waiting for a "METAL" stop sign to change colors, before making their turn, I firmly believe that some investigation is required.

NBTP

[FDokinawa]

lol.. it was just a story. just shows how the average lower enlisted soldier feels about officer and seinor enlited wives.

Now we did have an E-6s wife try and tell an E-4s wife what to do.. and the E-6s wife actually said "my husband outranks yours, so you have to do what I say." needless to say she almost got slapped. hilarity ensued.

And P chan.. yes, the cops/PMO should be called if someone is driving dangerously. But there is a very fine line in my eyes between driving dangerously, and driving safely, but faster than everyone esle. I will admit it, I speed around here.. but im never dangerous about it. Small streets, I do the speed limit and watch like a hawk for kids. on 58.. whole nother story. I also ALWAYS use my blinkers and make sure no scooters are comming. I know there is another thread with a huge arguement about drivers on it.. I dont want to get into that. I'm happy discussing how military members feel the need to correct anyone and everyone.

Ok.. next discussion...

Hats in buildings.. been "yelled" at many times for wearing a hat in the PX. Are people that bored?

[P_chan]

Oh no your wearing a hat inside! You might instigate a riot with behavior like that:D

[FDokinawa]

im working on it... next week its a hat and flip-flops

[P_chan]

Oh no! You'll really get people rilled up with that one! Who knows! Maybe next time you'll walk and talk on a cell phone:w00t: or worse yet, wear and earring:thumbup:

[FDokinawa]

1st sgt tip of the day.. LOL!!

You know, I got an artical 15 for wearing an earing on base.. yea, someone had something to prove.. and it wasnt me. lol

[Tempestuous]

I know a load of people that could congest up the shirts office for days for having piercings in ALL sorts of places.

When in uniform, understandable. When off duty I would say it is part of a moral thing to allow it. Maybe one day it will change.

I mean male ear piercing has changed significantly over the years, maybe one day the military will allow them when not in uniform??? Who knows, time will tell.

[FDokinawa]

I think if people could view the military more as a job, then a way of life it would help out a lot.

[drinkandrun]

I think if people could view the military more as a job, then a way of life it would help out a lot.

You know it can't work like that. Whether you're a fire fighter, police officer, or military member it's a culture and a lifestyle. How many times does a stock broker have to put his life on the line to save others.

[Muku]

I think if people could view the military more as a job, then a way of life it would help out a lot.
That is what the Japanese Self Defense Force does?:eek:

Didnt the Army even have commercials at one time that said something like....

Join the Army is not just a job, but a way of life!

[P_chan]

I think if people could view the military more as a job, then a way of life it would help out a lot.

Unfortunately most people view it as a way of life and not just as a job.

[The One]

You know this thread has taken a new form. Everyone is trying to correct FDOkinawa on his views. You can't teach an old dog new tricks. He saw someone get a ticket by someone who called it in on him. He believes the story of his co-worker because he knows him.
I guess people don't lie in the judicial system and have others do it for him. I believe you would have said anything also to help a person that you said, " The guy im talking about is the nicest, slowest talking guy ive ever met. He wouldnt break the law if it was life or death. He did not run that stop sign." That is crazy. How can you be soooo sure what someone would and would not do.
It is all up to individual perception. One may think that running a stop sign is dangerous because kids are in the area. Or maybe it was stupid and the guy didn't know what he saw. But in the end PMO felt that he rated the ticket. Win some and you lose some.
If earrings are not allowed on base you should have gotten in trouble for wearing on Base. Rules are there and if you break them it is a matter of time before you cross a Marine Gunnery Sergeant that will tell you what time it is. Do you have to listen? Hell yeah if you are active duty.

[Tanimaga]

It is all up to individual perception.


Is this not the problem? A military system flexible enough to consider rank (and rank by association) a substitute for ethical judgement? An E-2 filing a complaint will get nowhere the response an O-2 will just as the wife of the PMO's CO would get a complaint bouncing off the walls when compaired to that of an E-5.

In a military society where most training and schooling is abbrieviated, but one is lead to believe they "run the world", I have to be skeptical about giving that kind of power away.

As far as the "Gunnery Sergeant telling me what time it is"..I can read time, learned it in 1st grade.

[FDokinawa]

Exactly Tanimaga!! As I've pointed out, I was in the military for 8 years. Got the the rank of Sergeant before getting out. I know what it means to be in the military. Lives are on the line if people dont listen to the leaders. I am in no way calling for total anarchy in the military.

I just dont understand why poeple with rank cant "stay in their lane"? If your a company CO, then worry about your company.. dont worry about someone elses. Be a leader to your troops, but also show them that you are no better or differant then they are.

It's a lot of little things that cause people to leave the military.. and most of those little things could be fixed by the people with enough rank to make the changes. everything from wearing earings in civilian cloths to curfeew to weekly barracks inspections..

[atb35]

Is this not the problem? A military system flexible enough to consider rank (and rank by association) a substitute for ethical judgement? An E-2 filing a complaint will get nowhere the response an O-2 will just as the wife of the PMO's CO would get a complaint bouncing off the walls when compaired to that of an E-5.

In a military society where most training and schooling is abbrieviated, but one is lead to believe they "run the world", I have to be skeptical about giving that kind of power away.

As far as the "Gunnery Sergeant telling me what time it is"..I can read time, learned it in 1st grade.

Exactly Tanimaga!! As I've pointed out, I was in the military for 8 years. Got the the rank of Sergeant before getting out. I know what it means to be in the military. Lives are on the line if people dont listen to the leaders. I am in no way calling for total anarchy in the military.

I just dont understand why poeple with rank cant "stay in their lane"? If your a company CO, then worry about your company.. dont worry about someone elses. Be a leader to your troops, but also show them that you are no better or differant then they are.

It's a lot of little things that cause people to leave the military.. and most of those little things could be fixed by the people with enough rank to make the changes. everything from wearing earings in civilian cloths to curfeew to weekly barracks inspections..

People of higher rank do and rightly so get more attention then lower ranking people. Higher ranking members have a tendancy to be brighter (education and life experience), better behaved, and far more reliable then lower ranking ones. I am in no way saying people of lower rank should be ignored or not believed. If and when you go to battle, do you want to rely on the PFC or the Major? Think about why you would rely on the Major and you will see why they garner more respect and are 'listened to' more.

There are exceptions to everything, so just because you may have known one or two terrible higher ranking people, MOST are very good. The same can be said for lower ranking folks, there are some that could lead a battalion, but MOST cant.

The whole point of this thread is becoming skewed. Bottom line is if someone is breaking a regulation, then anyone in the military service has a right and the duty to correct that person. If you dont like it, whether your in the military or not....tough shit!! Someone, and I dont care if your an E-1 or an O-10 that goes up to someone else on or off base and starts berating them is just wrong. That is bad leadership and it doesnt do anything to help the situation.

As far as the ticket thing goes FD, honestly I dont care anymore. I found out for myself what the PMO does and how they run business. If that really did happen to your coworker, well, sorry, that sucks. Until I witness this type of action happening, I will not believe it.

[DougP]

As far as the ticket thing goes FD, honestly I dont care anymore. I found out for myself what the PMO does and how they run business. If that really did happen to your coworker, well, sorry, that sucks. Until I witness this type of action happening, I will not believe it.

Wow man, wow.... :thumbdown: Guess you believe anything PMO tells you huh? One phone call and you got it figured out.... Have fun sticking your head in the sand.:thumbup:

[FDokinawa]

People of higher rank do and rightly so get more
As far as the ticket thing goes FD, honestly I dont care anymore. I found out for myself what the PMO does and how they run business. If that really did happen to your coworker, well, sorry, that sucks. Until I witness this type of action happening, I will not believe it.

so your saying that you dont belive that someone, high ranking, thought it would be a good idea to give everyone "deputy" status(my words) and make it so that anyone could fill out a form online, or call a number and turn someone in for a moving violation?? Either you've only been in the military for a day, or you are very ignorant to how things work.

I was like that.. its not any more. things change. And thank god that changed.

[atb35]

so your saying that you dont belive that someone, high ranking, thought it would be a good idea to give everyone "deputy" status(my words) and make it so that anyone could fill out a form online, or call a number and turn someone in for a moving violation?? Either you've only been in the military for a day, or you are very ignorant to how things work.

I was like that.. its not any more. things change. And thank god that changed.

Wow man, wow.... :thumbdown: Guess you believe anything PMO tells you huh? One phone call and you got it figured out.... Have fun sticking your head in the sand.:thumbup:

I truly have nothing good to say to either statement here. Im going to make this my last post on this subject because I feel Im getting dumber each time I read it.....

[Tanimaga]

Im going to make this my last post on this subject because I feel Im getting dumber


Completely agree. DITTO...

[Isaak Brodsky]

It's not just some of the younger military members poisoned by excessive levels of testosterone and arrogance either. Some of the children, typically high schoolers, are way out of line.

Some years ago, one of my freshman comp. students, a newly graduated high school student, traveled way up north with a few of buddies and set a few parked cars ablaze on some side street. One of the cars (by now engulfed in flames) did some extensive damage to a nearby building. Somehow, these vandals got nabbed. But, what a pathetic example they'd set.

[okiprince07]

they're kids...what do you expect. Imagine now that japanese law is now going to be 18 legal age now, not 20....more and more complications now....gonna be terrible

[DougP]

Figured FD might have seen it before me but here it is..
http://www.mcbbutler.usmc.mil/pmo/traffic_violation_report.asp
the link to that form he was talking about.

[Muku]

they're kids...what do you expect. Imagine now that japanese law is now going to be 18 legal age now, not 20....more and more complications now....gonna be terrible

What complications are you talking about? Since there are no plans to drop the drinking age what difference will it make?

In fact it very well may make things better in that 18 year olds will now all get charged as adults and not the usual now as juveniles.

(Yes there are exceptions to the case where junveniles here are charged as adults)

[Isaak Brodsky]

they're kids...what do you expect. Imagine now that japanese law is now going to be 18 legal age now, not 20....more and more complications now....gonna be terrible

Well, on one level you're right. He was nineteen - a college freshman. He was legally not a "kid" in the States, but here he was considered a "kid."

If the legal age were lowered, you'll then see a huge number of young people now held to a higher standard of acceptable conduct. Presently, young people feel as though they can do just about anything they want and still get away with it.

Look at the bozosoku as a good example.

[Tony Stacks]

Well I'll tell you I think the no wearing earings in the club is the dumbest rule ever and don't blame just the young guys either because when I was in I've seen SSgts and Gunnys wearing earings in the club too.

I've seem MANY SNCO's bouncing at clubs off base which I know SOFA status people are NOT supposed to do.

My advice to you just take care of your self and YOU troops that work FOR you. When your off work just relax and enjoy the little time off you earned.

[Tony Stacks]

A side note you NEED to be careful on who you correct. I've been out of the military for over a year and people now and then will try to give me shyt for wearing earing and I even go off on them.

There are foriegners here that are NOT SOFA status.

If a military member crosses the line with me I'll have the JP's arrest their ass.

[The One]

A side note you NEED to be careful on who you correct. I've been out of the military for over a year and people now and then will try to give me shyt for wearing earing and I even go off on them.

There are foriegners here that are NOT SOFA status.

If a military member crosses the line with me I'll have the JP's arrest their ass.

Arrest them for what? Asking if you are in the military and why you are wearing earings? The JP's barely arrest people for fighting in public. If you can find one around at all.

[Ammoyankee]

Arrest them for what? Asking if you are in the military and why you are wearing earings? The JP's barely arrest people for fighting in public. If you can find one around at all.

That's easy, just go where the Americans are!

[Ammoyankee]

A side note you NEED to be careful on who you correct. I've been out of the military for over a year and people now and then will try to give me shyt for wearing earing and I even go off on them.

There are foriegners here that are NOT SOFA status.

If a military member crosses the line with me I'll have the JP's arrest their ass.

I would never correct a hippy with earings!
So, if I poke you in the eye with a sharp stick, will you call the JP's?:thumbup1:

[Tony Stacks]

I would never correct a hippy with earings!
So, if I poke you in the eye with a sharp stick, will you call the JP's?:thumbup1:

LMAO thats a good one. I remeber people would always joke about my low reg haircut and call me a hippie lol good times oorah Marine Corps gotta love it though:first:

[shuichi]

OK, so I know Gate 2 is a wild place, but it seems as though the military would be more concerned with the Outlaws Motorcycle Gang operating thier bars out there than a few dependants wearing ear rings. I apologize if I should have created a new blog, but I am am really worried for my small island more about this than other things. If you are in the military or not can't the military stop these people from being here? After reading about these gangs it makes scared. They have been known as real organised crime. How can they be allowed to do business with military?

[shuichi]

Why does no one answer? Do you want them on Gate 2 to sell drugs or recruit your children? Stand up Marines!!!

[P_chan]

Is it a gang run by americans? I've never heard of it. And why would you be worried if they recruited your "children"? If you taught your kids right, they'll know to stay away from that crap.

Now if it's yakuza run, that's a totally different story. The US government has no business stepping into yakuza affiars.

[watzitoou]

Figured FD might have seen it before me but here it is..
http://www.mcbbutler.usmc.mil/pmo/traffic_violation_report.asp
the link to that form he was talking about.

That link is a waste of time, it doesn't work!! After you hit submit, it will say couldn't be sent and all the information you put was already cleared. Thats the link they have on commercial all the time.

[Tony Stacks]

I think P-Chan hit it right on the nail.

[Go-Shay]

OK, so I know Gate 2 is a wild place, but it seems as though the military would be more concerned with the Outlaws Motorcycle Gang operating thier bars out there than a few dependants wearing ear rings. I apologize if I should have created a new blog, but I am am really worried for my small island more about this than other things. If you are in the military or not can't the military stop these people from being here? After reading about these gangs it makes scared. They have been known as real organised crime. How can they be allowed to do business with military?

shuichi, Okinawa has always had it fair share of rumors. Do you have any facts to back up this? as far as I know they are just another MC located in Okinawa and all of them have to answer the Japanese Police. The dependents that you speak of may not even be sofa status. Remember there are allot of foreigners(not only Americans) that live here that have nothing to do with the military.

[socalheart]

OK, so I know Gate 2 is a wild place, but it seems as though the military would be more concerned with the Outlaws Motorcycle Gang operating thier bars out there than a few dependants wearing ear rings.

I've never heard about this type of gang either, at least not where Americans are involved. I know of some Americans who are motorcycle enthusiasts that have a members only bar on rte 330, but they're mostly older folks and hardly a gang. I also know that a few bars/clubs on gate 2 street are owned by retired Americans who are motorcyclists. They're mostly law-abiding folks as well, at least the ones I know personally. heh.

[jemareius]

I think the problem is none of these kids have ever had any discipline and even after basic and tech school, they still lack discipline. They have a little bit of money in their pocket and free time. That a dangerous combination.:thumbdown:

[Tony Stacks]

I think the problem is all these stupid new rules now that were'nt around when we were in. They make it so restrictive on them that they act out even worse. Stupid cerfews and liberty cards are nonsense and all the rules are just creating an enviroment where they will get wild when let loose.

[socalheart]

Stupid cerfews and liberty cards are nonsense and all the rules are just creating an enviroment where they will get wild when let loose.

I don't disagree, but the curfews and liberty cards were started for a reason. Some dumba$$es went and broke the laws and screwed it for the rest of the folks. :mad:

[Tony Stacks]

I don't disagree, but the curfews and liberty cards were started for a reason. Some dumba$ went and broke the laws and screwed it for the rest of the folks. :mad:


technically that is correct but it really boils down to the military's way of punishing everyone for the mistakes of a few.

Actually it is just becaise commands are too lazy to punish individuals.

[ststephen65]

Why does no one answer? Do you want them on Gate 2 to sell drugs or recruit your children? Stand up Marines!!!


give me a ****in break, you sound like a really bad govt sponsered terrorist comercial like the one that says buy smoking pot your helping terrorism SHEESH.

[Tony Stacks]

give me a ****in break, you sound like a really bad govt sponsered terrorist comercial like the one that says buy smoking pot your helping terrorism SHEESH.


That's a good one. This guy sounds like a damn AFN commercial. LMAO

[Tony Stacks]

Why does no one answer? Do you want them on Gate 2 to sell drugs or recruit your children? Stand up Marines!!!


Is this an AFN commercial?

1.As far as I know a lot of members of motercycle clubs are USMC Vets and other Vets as well so some Marine you are.

2. The military has no say over civilians off base if they are not SOFA status.

[31aivlis]

sure there are a lot of dumb people here, but at the same time when there are so many stupid rules in place i think it pushes them to not want to follow the rules. i know rules are important but earings... youve gotta be kidding. that is why im civilian.

[P_chan]

It's true the some of the cerfew rules are stupid. However, socal is right in saying that it was brought on by bad individuals. Everyone getting punished for the actions of a few is the way of the military. If you haven't figured that out yet, your a tad slow IMO. Honestly, I don't see why people complain so much. Your in the military it's part of the job so suck it up, and shut up.

[Tony Stacks]

It's true the some of the cerfew rules are stupid. However, socal is right in saying that it was brought on by bad individuals. Everyone getting punished for the actions of a few is the way of the military. If you haven't figured that out yet, your a tad slow IMO. Honestly, I don't see why people complain so much. Your in the military it's part of the job so suck it up, and shut up.


I know the military is stupid that's why I got out but people don't join knowing that if the come here they will have those extra gay ass rules.

[P_chan]

I knew there were "gay ass" rules once I joined.

It's not like it's some big secret.

[Tony Stacks]

I knew there were "gay ass" rules once I joined.

It's not like it's some big secret.


Well I did but not to that extent. I was here when they first came up with it and I had a gold card anyway so it did'nt affect me but I mean the Corps I thought I joined was gone by the time I left.

It's way too politically corrct now and the rules get more and more rediculous.

[shuichi]

Yes i have proof, look on Outlaws Phillipines webpage. First contact Okinawa in their Gallery. You will see James Smith, Bill Hickcock, and some other SOFA status putting on their Outlaws patches. Also if you look under winipikia it shows the history of Outlaws MC. I don't have problem with people riding motorcycles, nor do I problem with the good clubs out there. I do have problem with Americans going to forien lands and bringing a known organized criminal gang there. These people are well known for 2 things, drugs and guns.I apologize if I sound stupid, but I'm concerned as I am in states now and have 3 children of my own there.

[shuichi]

Also I wish to say that I really like American military, I think most of you are hard working, great people. I think these are a small group of ex GIs that make some look bad. Yes PChan I agree if they were Yakuza this is Japanese Police problem. I know that James Smith (leader) has connection to Tominaga.
I just wish someone could talk to NCIS to have them investigate. I know I am not wrong about this. Also Outlaws has been in jail for murder alot also. They are same as Hell's Angels,Banditos, Pagans and such...

[Tanimaga]

These people are well known for 2 things, drugs and guns.I apologize if I sound stupid, but I'm concerned as I am in states now and have 3 children of my own there.

At least here they are also known for fund raising activities, special olympics charity events, and being local business owners.
Not many true outlaws will put up a webpage with their photos and hang out spots. I've been around these guys some..been to their events, and know quite a few..none are hardcore criminals that I've met.
Seen alot more theft, assaults, and drug running from active duty personnel than I've ever seen from these guys.

[shuichi]

Gomen Nasai:crying:

[shuichi]

Tanimagasan, I hope you right! I used to study English from Billsan long time ago. He was nice guy. My freind show me them get patches, so I am scared.
Jamesan so quite, but look like nice guy. I read bad thing about Outlaws from internet, then I see Jamesan patches... They look so real.How do you know what they do after bar closed? I am still worry.

[Tanimaga]

How do you know what they do after bar closed? I am still worry.

One was kind enough to teach you English. Why don't you ask him?
They probably go home to their families like most everyone else.

[shuichi]

I wish I could, but I see that he died last month.... They say because complication with cancer... He was 37 years old. Very sad.

[Tanimaga]

Apologies...I had forgotten.

[shuichi]

Dai jo bu, Taminagasan... and I will remember him as kind man when he taught me...

[Ammoyankee]

At least here they are also known for fund raising activities, special olympics charity events, and being local business owners.
Not many true outlaws will put up a webpage with their photos and hang out spots. I've been around these guys some..been to their events, and know quite a few..none are hardcore criminals that I've met.
Seen alot more theft, assaults, and drug running from active duty personnel than I've ever seen from these guys.

Unfortunately, they did patch in with an international MC that is known for crime and are 1%er's. So, no matter what they do, they are still Outlaws... As with most truly "organized" crime, how much would you really get to see???

[Go-Shay]

Yes i have proof, look on Outlaws Phillipines webpage. First contact Okinawa in their Gallery. You will see James Smith, Bill Hickcock, and some other SOFA status putting on their Outlaws patches. Also if you look under winipikia it shows the history of Outlaws MC. I don't have problem with people riding motorcycles, nor do I problem with the good clubs out there. I do have problem with Americans going to forien lands and bringing a known organized criminal gang there. These people are well known for 2 things, drugs and guns.I apologize if I sound stupid, but I'm concerned as I am in states now and have 3 children of my own there.

first off yes we were all saddened by the early death of Bill. However putting on a patch and belonging to a MC does not make you a criminal. Yes we have all heard stories and anyone can use Google, but that is not proof that they are doing anything illegal. Basically it is just spreading rumors, and there are also privacy issues involved.:thumbdown:

[Ammoyankee]

first off yes we were all saddened by the early death of Bill. However putting on a patch and belonging to a MC does not make you a criminal. Yes we have all heard stories and anyone can use Google, but that is not proof that they are doing anything illegal. Basically it is just spreading rumors, and there are also privacy issues involved.:thumbdown:

Understood but let's face it... If I patched in with the Hells Angels, I am probably not a "Pillar of the Community"! The whole guilty by association thing has to kick in somewhere...

[socalheart]

I read bad thing about Outlaws from internet, then I see Jamesan patches... They look so real.How do you know what they do after bar closed? I am still worry.
Don't believe everything you read online. :rolleyes: I have Navy patches on my jean jacket, but it doesn't mean I'm in the Navy.

Understood but let's face it... If I patched in with the Hells Angels, I am probably not a "Pillar of the Community"! The whole guilty by association thing has to kick in somewhere...
It doesn't necessarily mean that a person is a drug dealer or criminal, because he is associated or has a patch from that group though. Although, the Hells Angels is an extreme motorcycle group and not fairly comparable to the guys here on island. I see what you meant though.

I'm not buddies or friends with those guys, but I've met them as acquaintences in the past. They're nice people, albeit morally ambiguous sometimes. heh. They're mostly retired Americans, although a few of them do work with the military and may have SOFA status. It's irresponsible, as an adult, to accuse the whole group of criminal activity in a public forum and calling for a criminal investigation of the individuals without a molecule of evidence besides hearsay on the internet.

[Ammoyankee]

Well, I know a few of them personally too and have known them for a number of years. And, as an avid rider on island, I do attend many events and know at least a few members from all the clubs. While not to condemn everyone who is wearing the patch, I am hear to tell you, they are definately not saints. Anyone who has the least bit of familiarity of the biker community will tell you. If you patch in/charter a new chapter with a 1% international M/C, there are certain things you WILL be responsible for, whether it's illegal or not no matter your location...

[shuichi]

So, why does NCIS or proper authority at least not check them?

[Tanimaga]

Who says they haven't? Maybe they are clean guys who enjoy the bad boy image.

[Tony Stacks]

Why does it matter? Why can't ppl just mind their own business?

[InFaMoUs]

I knew there were "gay ass" rules once I joined.

It's not like it's some big secret.

QFT... Its not a big secret

[Ringo3020]

Shuichi, Steven Brigante

I didn't know Bill taught you english!!

My name is Steven, I am Shinjo,Kiyohide Sensei's Student from Okinawa. I know Sakumoto Sensei and have great respect for him. I have recently moved back to America and wish to contact uchinanchu in America to stay friends and close to a society and culture that I have come to know as closer to my heart than my own. I spent almost 10 years with Shinjo Sensei and consider him like my father. I noticed that Arashiro Sensei has the same name, any relation? Shinjo in the Okinawan hogan is pronounced Arashiro or Aragusuku. Shinjo Sensei's father's name was Seiyu Shinjo, but they would sometimes call him Arashiro.
Yoroshiku onegaishimas, Steven

[straightshooter]

Steve,
Hey I remember you. You still pissed about getting thrown off of Okinawa for beatin your kids? Dude your not japanese why are you talkin like that?

StraightShooter.

[FDokinawa]

mmm the plot thickens... :D

[valve stem]

I do not care!:star:

[P_chan]

I do not care!:star:

:rolleyes:You obviously do care....otherwise you wouldn't have posted anything!

[Muku]

I do not care!:star:


WOW what a 1st post here......:rolleyes:

Very insightful, anything else to add?

[okisteve]

Hey - he's our 988th member! Cut him some slack. Did you ever know any valve stem that really cared about anything?

[shuichi]

I just read this post and I feel like I need to respond to some really weird people making some really liablis remarks.
1st... To suppose things about people is just malicious and a little creepy to pull someones personal statements from the web.
2nd...If that man ever touched those kids(other than holding their hands to walk them to school) he wouldn't be put out of Japan for overstaying his visa for 3 days for taking his wife to the hospital. He would be in jail.
3... If you live in glass houses, you may want to leave the stones on the ground. Some peoples stories about why they are in Okinawa working for the military, considering what they say about there own past... Just doesn't make sense. But it does make sense to me. It's just sick!

[shuichi]

I was told once, by my best friend who happened to be my wifes cousin. " You think that you understand the Tsukayama family, but you don't understand... Not yet."
He turned out to be correct. I was pushed off of a 5 story building by my best friend, put myself back together with help from no one. I really don't need people making false and malicious statements against anyone while I'm talking on this forum. Please excuse my pissed off attitude, but that statement really pissed me off!!!

[DOCROB]

I can't stand the way the military makes an asumption about somebody based on thier rank. The military says RHIP well I think you need to take into account they age of the person as well. I'm 31 years old and have been in the military close to 8 years, and still get treated like shit just because people see my rank. They automatically think I'm some dumb wet behind the ears kid that don't know shit about anything. Granted I joined late in the game but don't take it as not having been around the block a few times. DOCROB

[Trail]

I can't stand the way the military makes an asumption about somebody based on thier rank. The military says RHIP well I think you need to take into account they age of the person as well. I'm 31 years old and have been in the military close to 8 years, and still get treated like shit just because people see my rank. They automatically think I'm some dumb wet behind the ears kid that don't know shit about anything. Granted I joined late in the game but don't take it as not having been around the block a few times. DOCROB

Agreed Docrob. Hubby is 25 and joined the AF at 23 and gets treated like a child and gets lumped in with the hooligans. It's not fair to him and rank matters very little in the real world outside the military. People are ways asking why he's an A1C since he has grey hair already and looks older (since he is) than most A1C's. IMO, it's none of their GD business and it's rude of them to ask.

[perfect10]

I am really tired of seeing individuals violating the reg’s. It just is showing more and more that lack of respect for the rules. In the time I was in the AF, I found the people that violated the small rules really violated the big ones. I hope the individuals that are not wearing Helmets of reflective vest have read about what happens when you don’t wear the proper equipment. In addition, as for the individuals that choose to ignore it you need to think what if that individual is an aircraft maintainer or someone that has your life in there hand. You know they only follow tech data as well as they follow other rules, and everyone that saw did just what you do and turned there back to the issue. I hope you’re not injured or killed because of some one else’s ignorance….

[Tony Stacks]

I am really tired of seeing individuals violating the reg’s. ….


I'll agree with that BUT how does wearing earings at the club hurt the mission?
:cool:

[perfect10]

I see it as a respect for authority and in the Military with out respect what do you have. I really don’t see why they can’t change the rules on men and earring I don’t get any of the piercing rules if they can’t be seen in uniform, but the rules are the rules. Trust me I miss my piercing that I had when I joined.

[Tony Stacks]

I see it as a respect for authority and in the Military with out respect what do you have. I really don’t see why they can’t change the rules on men and earring I don’t get any of the piercing rules if they can’t be seen in uniform, but the rules are the rules. Trust me I miss my piercing that I had when I joined.


So I see what your saying. It's about principle. Following the rules because they are rules and not because they may or may not be right?:army:

[okisteve]

You have my attention, guys. Keep up this discussion please.

[Ammoyankee]

I'll agree with that BUT how does wearing earings at the club hurt the mission?
:cool:


It doesn't singularly. But then, factor in what "usually" comes next... bandanas (could be confused with gangs which military already has a rising problem with), 5X shirts dragging the floor, pants down to the bottom of @$$ with underwear hanging out everywhere, multiple ear, eyebrow, lip and nose piercings and the list goes on...

If one doesn't like it, there is a plethora of clubs off base to patronize!

[perfect10]

So why do people that join the Military and know that they are going to be held to a high standard in ways they do the things that they do. Do the people riding the bikes with out protective equipment know that their families won't be paid if they die or that their medical might not be covered if they are severely injured?

[Lursyobwoc]

So I see what your saying. It's about principle. Following the rules because they are rules and not because they may or may not be right?:army:

But it's not a matter of what you believe may or may not be right. The way I see it, there is a rule about, let's just say the earrings since that's seems to be the topic here, because it doesn't present a professional appearance. The same holds true for the baggy drawers, size XXXXL t-shirts for someone that would typically wear an x-small, etc.. What type of professional appearance does that present?

It's not our job as members of the military to try and change the military to the rules for the rest of the world but to abide by the rules that are established by the upper echelon. It's an all volunteer military that joined for whatever reason but joined KNOWING that there would be rules to abide by. If they don't want to follow the rules, then there should be repurcussions, even for something as simple as wearing an earring.

[copete]

shhheeee... i havnt been here long and i think its pretty bad... and i just got in from korea... ah lol now thats a sight

[okifamily3]

I'd say something, but only during certain times. My husband thinks it's OK to correct everyone, but sometimes, you know when you shouldnt. Like when there is only one of him and 10 of them. Common sense would say, keep your mouth shut, but sometimes my husband doesnt get it. But, you never know when correcting someone might change the way they do things. I told a lady in my building that she shouldnt be driving her car with her infant son in the front seat. (She does this alot and I see her everywhere). Since then, I see her driving with him in the back in his car carrier. Just think of what could have happened to that child if they were in an accident?

I praise you for wanting people to abide by rules and be safe. My husband calls me an old lady for me wanted to do things right (I have no clue why, Im only 25!).

I correct people when I see them swearing around kids or smoking in my face. Just as my husband will correct a Marine if he sees him wearing something he shouldnt. It's common sense for most of us, but some need a little bit extra help in that department. I think as long as you are polite then it will be ok. I often see a lot of people pull rank to get things and sometimes that is the only way to get someone to shape up, but not always. I saw some guy j-walk on Gate 2 street, but there was no cross-walk light so Im assuming the guy didnt know .Then all of the sudden, some guy runs up to him and starts yelling at him and demanding his I.D. card. He said he was some officer and he was going to report him. Im sure that if they guy would have said "Hey, you shouldnt J-walk" everything woudl have been good. But this guy looked like an ass for no reason. Just try the nice approach first.

[slickmetal]

^^ Ne.. Nec.. Necro.. Necro'd Thread!

I just "pretend slap" all the okinawans who let there child roam around the mini cube vans and the like - while they talk on there cell phone and make turns without a signal.

[xxzjxx]

I have been in the military for 16 years. First time being stationed in Okinawa. I am telling you that these young military guys and gals are going insane. I don't think they get that this is not the United States. This past weekend I saw a lot military guys wearing earrings in the clubs. I thought it was ok until I saw an Air Force commercial that said it wasn't ok. I saw a group of guys riding four wheeler motorcycles down 58 with no helmets or reflector vest. At the light I said to one that was closest to me. "Hope you are not in the military". He said FU and took off. Don't think I didn't try and catch that sucker. But of course too much traffic.

Maybe I didn't see it in the States. But here in Okinawa these I guess they don't make it too far in military. Carreers are ruined here and its there own fault. I heard a guy say the only way to leave the Oki an E-4 is to come here an E-5.

Should I go off base with my eyes closed. Or should I correct everyone everywhere I go. I think I should just stay away from Gate 2.

Frustrated.

this post was an lame rant

[xxzjxx]

I'd say something, but only during certain times. My husband thinks it's OK to correct everyone, but sometimes, you know when you shouldnt. Like when there is only one of him and 10 of them. Common sense would say, keep your mouth shut, but sometimes my husband doesnt get it. But, you never know when correcting someone might change the way they do things. I told a lady in my building that she shouldnt be driving her car with her infant son in the front seat. (She does this alot and I see her everywhere). Since then, I see her driving with him in the back in his car carrier. Just think of what could have happened to that child if they were in an accident?

I praise you for wanting people to abide by rules and be safe. My husband calls me an old lady for me wanted to do things right (I have no clue why, Im only 25!).

I correct people when I see them swearing around kids or smoking in my face. Just as my husband will correct a Marine if he sees him wearing something he shouldnt. It's common sense for most of us, but some need a little bit extra help in that department. I think as long as you are polite then it will be ok. I often see a lot of people pull rank to get things and sometimes that is the only way to get someone to shape up, but not always. I saw some guy j-walk on Gate 2 street, but there was no cross-walk light so Im assuming the guy didnt know .Then all of the sudden, some guy runs up to him and starts yelling at him and demanding his I.D. card. He said he was some officer and he was going to report him. Im sure that if they guy would have said "Hey, you shouldnt J-walk" everything woudl have been good. But this guy looked like an ass for no reason. Just try the nice approach first.


Classic arrogant American woman, you gotta correct everybody and make them do the things YOU think are right. Just because you see it going on, dosnt mean you should say something about it. YOU are the reason that Americans have such a sour reputation around the world.

Everybody else can mind their own buisness, you should too. Stop trying to be the mother of the world, people are supposed to make mistakes and learn by themselves. If they want to swear around their kids, then LET THEM, its THEIR KIDS NOT YOURS, SWEETHEART

In summary, mind your own biz, dont interfere with peoples lives.

[Old guy]

I have been in the military for 16 years. First time being stationed in Okinawa. I am telling you that these young military guys and gals are going insane. I don't think they get that this is not the United States. This past weekend I saw a lot military guys wearing earrings in the clubs. I thought it was ok until I saw an Air Force commercial that said it wasn't ok. I saw a group of guys riding four wheeler motorcycles down 58 with no helmets or reflector vest. At the light I said to one that was closest to me. "Hope you are not in the military". He said FU and took off. Don't think I didn't try and catch that sucker. But of course too much traffic.

Maybe I didn't see it in the States. But here in Okinawa these I guess they don't make it too far in military. Carreers are ruined here and its there own fault. I heard a guy say the only way to leave the Oki an E-4 is to come here an E-5.

Should I go off base with my eyes closed. Or should I correct everyone everywhere I go. I think I should just stay away from Gate 2.

Frustrated.

I can't read all these posts lol. In Japan, 3 or 4 wheel motorcycles are classified as cars and don't require a helmet (or vest? a base thing?).

[xxzjxx]

I dare somebody to tell me how to treat my kids or how to raise them, if this lady came up to me and told me that i'm bringing them up wrong, I would blast her so hard she would be afraid to speak to another random person again.

Folks you gotta stay out of other peoples lives, correcting random people on the streets just makes you look like a complete drama queen. Some people get their rocks off by doing this because they feel better about themselves. That is, telling people that they are bad parents (basically) or telling them they are wearing something you do not agree with.

[Muku]

I can't read all these posts lol. In Japan, 3 or 4 wheel motorcycles are classified as cars and don't require a helmet (or vest? a base thing?).
Vests are a base thing, and 4 wheeler's are classified as a four wheeled vehicle, smiliar to a car.

[NotSoAverageWife]

I'd say something, but only during certain times. My husband thinks it's OK to correct everyone, but sometimes, you know when you shouldnt. Like when there is only one of him and 10 of them. Common sense would say, keep your mouth shut, but sometimes my husband doesnt get it. But, you never know when correcting someone might change the way they do things. I told a lady in my building that she shouldnt be driving her car with her infant son in the front seat. (She does this alot and I see her everywhere). Since then, I see her driving with him in the back in his car carrier. Just think of what could have happened to that child if they were in an accident?

I praise you for wanting people to abide by rules and be safe. My husband calls me an old lady for me wanted to do things right (I have no clue why, Im only 25!).

I correct people when I see them swearing around kids or smoking in my face. Just as my husband will correct a Marine if he sees him wearing something he shouldnt. It's common sense for most of us, but some need a little bit extra help in that department. I think as long as you are polite then it will be ok. I often see a lot of people pull rank to get things and sometimes that is the only way to get someone to shape up, but not always. I saw some guy j-walk on Gate 2 street, but there was no cross-walk light so Im assuming the guy didnt know .Then all of the sudden, some guy runs up to him and starts yelling at him and demanding his I.D. card. He said he was some officer and he was going to report him. Im sure that if they guy would have said "Hey, you shouldnt J-walk" everything woudl have been good. But this guy looked like an ass for no reason. Just try the nice approach first.

I see what you are saying and can agree with some of that. I also agree about the kids issue. If I am walking around the exchange with my 7yr old daughter and these young guys come in talking nasty. I will let them know that there is a young girl around and to please watch what they say. That is my child and I have every right to say something. There are places they need to keep a lid on it. The exchange is one of those places. I also think there are places that you have to excuse such language. Such as at my husbands softball games. That is one of those times and places that you kinda expect to hear such language.

[xxzjxx]

I love the reaction from dumb americans when they experience something they dissagree with for the first time in a foreign country, and there is nothing they can do about it.

For example, there was a lady on here complaining about the pornography being near the manga section at bookbox or something, and she said "I PROMPTLY SPOKE WITH THE MANAGER!!! HMFFF!!" This is great, because Japanese see nothing wrong with it, but at the same time, in their heads they are thinking "GO AWAY CRAZY LADY".

[xxzjxx]

I see what you are saying and can agree with some of that. I also agree about the kids issue. If I am walking around the exchange with my 7yr old daughter and these young guys come in talking nasty. I will let them know that there is a young girl around and to please watch what they say. That is my child and I have every right to say something. There are places they need to keep a lid on it. The exchange is one of those places. I also think there are places that you have to excuse such language. Such as at my husbands softball games. That is one of those times and places that you kinda expect to hear such language.

I bet your are lying and you are afraid to say something, everybody talks some big game online.

[Sex Wax]

I bet your are lying and you are afraid to say something, everybody talks some big game online.

I dont talk a big game. You sound like a tool. I hang out at Fujiyama's and the Gate 2 Garage on the weekends. No online talk there.

[NotSoAverageWife]

Oh yes, that's it! I must be! Me and my "big game online"!

[Muku]

For example, there was a lady on here complaining about the pornography being near the manga section at bookbox or something, and she said "I PROMPTLY SPOKE WITH THE MANAGER!!! HMFFF!!" This is great, because Japanese see nothing wrong with it, but at the same time, in their heads they are thinking "GO AWAY CRAZY LADY".

:rolleyes: Yeah right, like some lady is in a Japanese Bookstore and walked up to the manager in her perfectly spoken English and told him off about the magazines, which are not porn per say btw.:rolleyes: